Denver

[Geo-Guy15]

I was a little surprised to get on the forum tonight and see that a thread on Denver has not been posted yet. I'm assuming everyone is still upset from the UVU embarrassment, as am I...

Denver seems to be a decent team this year at least according to scouting reports and box scores... Admittedly I have not seen them play this year... If anyone on the forum has, I'd be very interested to hear your take on them.

Quick Comparison:
Denver
Record: 6-3
RPI: 264
D1 Wins: Santa Clara, Lipscomb, UVU, Idaho State, South Alabama, San Diego
D1 Losses: Milwaukee, Wyoming, Air Force

Weber State
Record: 5-4
RPI: 204
D1 Wins: Central Michigan, Drake, Murray State
D1 Losses: Utah State, South Dakota State, BYU
D1 Embarrassments: UVU

I think this is a winnable game depending on which version of Weber State shows up. Part of me wants to think that they players and coaches will be so disappointed with the loss the other night that they'll come out angry and play well. Denver is 13th in the nation in scoring defense... Don't really know if that more is a reflection of their actual defense or some of the garbage teams they've played. If we let Senglin and Gittens take garbage looks like they do sometimes, it'll be a long game... If we can establish a presence in the paint and keep Bolomboy and Braxton out of foul trouble, I think we've got a shot.

In my humble opinion, I think the Summit Leauge is better than the Big Sky. It'll be nice to compare ourselves to a presumably mid-level Summit team.

Weber 60 Denver 57

 

[SWWeatherCat]

Not sure what team I expect to see (ROOT Sports) but not sure I really care either. The crap home schedule and the Road2Reno set the tone for this season. The USU loss (last year and this year) already had me upset, UVU just cemented my outlook for the season. The Gulf Coast Classic and (almost wins) vsUSU and @BYU just aren't a consolation for the same ol' disappointments. I don't suppose Denver comes to Ogden next year, we can probably just add them to a long list of teams that "will not play in Ogden."

 

[STGWildcat]

Weber State is so much more talented than this. I'd hate to give up Rahe because of his ability to recruit, but he has had plenty of years to do something, and it's the same old, same old.

Having said all that, Kyndahl Hill is showing me a few things today, which I have been waiting for, for a long time. He is eating Denver's inside guys alive.

 

[baller]

Another uninspired effort today. Rahe just didn't have them ready to play. No energy at all, especially Senglin. It is so disappointing to see teams with so little talent take it to us. They shot uncontested three's all game long, 13-27. Denver was a bunch of slow, small (6'3"-6-6") white guys who couldn't compete on the boards, couldn't compete with quickness, couldn't stop Weber's inside game, but were great at hitting uncontested threes. We were poorly coached and didn't take advantage of any of their weaknesses. It is hard for me to understand how we could lose to such a team. But after UVU I guess I shouldn't expect more.

Looks like the posters here have given up on the team. Just a total lack of interest it seems... Can't say I blame them. It is one thing if we didn't have talent and no chance to win. I think we have had more talent than every team we have played so far except for SDSU & BYU. We should be 8-2. Maybe even 9-1. We just don't have the coaching talent to lead the team to victory. I am sure the players are getting discouraged also.

After watching McKay Cannon and Dusty Baker miss 3-pointers all game, and doing a poor job defensing, if I were Richardson or Jefferson I would be pissed that I wasn't even given a chance.

 

[WSUfan4ever]

Why does everyone keep saying Rahe is such a great recruiter? We point out all the flaws in the team like coaches didn't get players ready, they made key turnovers, blah, blah, blah ... Maybe he should start recruiting a few players who can do those things on their own. Who care about in state games. Sure, coaching is a large part of it, but maybe the recruits aren't as great as everyone thinks?

 

[SWWeatherCat]

I'd say he's an above average recruiter, how else would he win so many games while being out-coached so frequently?

 

[UtahPirate]

if I were Richardson or Jefferson I would be pissed that I wasn't even given a chance.

Didn't watch, didn't listen. Did check the box score to see if our coach has decided to expand his ridiculous short bench. Cannon 1-7, Baker 2-7, eight players is all.

I won't be there on Tuesday night either and I don't have a conflict. I won't go watch those two talented players rot. Rahe's coaching has really gotten to me. He's taken the fun out of something I love.

 

[SWWeatherCat]

if I were Richardson or Jefferson I would be pissed that I wasn't even given a chance.

Didn't watch, didn't listen. Did check the box score to see if our coach has decided to expand his ridiculous short bench. Cannon 1-7, Baker 2-7, eight players is all.

Yeah, but you should have seen their perimeter defense.

 

[SWWeatherCat]

...meanwhile, Montana St. wins at San Jose and Northern Colorado beats Colorado St. at home.

 

[STGWildcat]

Why does everyone keep saying Rahe is such a great recruiter? We point out all the flaws in the team like coaches didn't get players ready, they made key turnovers, blah, blah, blah ... Maybe he should start recruiting a few players who can do those things on their own. Who care about in state games. Sure, coaching is a large part of it, but maybe the recruits aren't as great as everyone thinks?

Damian Lillard. Davion Berry. Joel Bolomboy. To name a few of his good recruits. Most high school players aren't fully developed. There's a reason most freshman ride the bench (excluding places like Kentucky where they get one-and-done four-star recruits). It takes time for them to become effective at the next level. Weber and other schools recruit players who scored 20+ points a game in high school and don't do anything in college until their junior year.

Damian Lillard isn't the player he is today if not for assistant coaches helping him develop his skills. He credits coaches all the time for his development, whether they be Weber State coaches or otherwise.

I agree with you that more in state players would help with the in-state games due to wanting pride to win. But overall, I have no issues with recruiting out of state. Why limit yourself to one state?

 

[STGWildcat]

I'll also mention Senglin here. He has scored more than 20 in a game consistently. Despite his weaknesses (turnovers), he can take over games at times. He almost pulled it off against Denver (Weber's final 11 points). If I'm the coaching staff, I'm trying to instill that kind of urgency in all my players for 40 minutes, not just in crunch time. Which would be more possible if Rahe used his bench more effectively (fresh legs).

Weber has more than enough talent. They just don't know how to use it.

 

[WSUfan4ever]

I'll also mention Senglin here. He has scored more than 20 in a game consistently. Despite his weaknesses (turnovers), he can take over games at times. He almost pulled it off against Denver (Weber's final 11 points). If I'm the coaching staff, I'm trying to instill that kind of urgency in all my players for 40 minutes, not just in crunch time. Which would be more possible if Rahe used his bench more effectively (fresh legs).

Weber has more than enough talent. They just don't know how to use it.

Sorry, I don't buy it. So you define great recruiting as a player here and there who reaches that level? Sure Senglin has been a great college player but this team has been a revolving door of supposed great recruits. I define great recruiting as a team full of players who can execute a coaches vision. These coaches recruit great athletes and try to turn them into players.

3 years ago it was WSU's version of the "fab-five"... the greatest class ever by Rahe. And now Hunter, Richardson, and Jefferson can't even get in a game, and in my mind the verdict is still out on Braxton. Great recruits? or bring in tons of "athletes" until you find a diamond in the rough? What about all the great players that get away each year? To me a great recruiter brings in players that they see potential in and then develops that player into what they can become. Recruiting doesn't end with inking a scholarship.

Damian had the mind set to be great and these coaches allowed that to happen. I am just glad they did not screw it up.

 

[WSUfan4ever]

Why does everyone keep saying Rahe is such a great recruiter? We point out all the flaws in the team like coaches didn't get players ready, they made key turnovers, blah, blah, blah ... Maybe he should start recruiting a few players who can do those things on their own. Who care about in state games. Sure, coaching is a large part of it, but maybe the recruits aren't as great as everyone thinks?

Damian Lillard. Davion Berry. Joel Bolomboy. To name a few of his good recruits. Most high school players aren't fully developed. There's a reason most freshman ride the bench (excluding places like Kentucky where they get one-and-done four-star recruits). It takes time for them to become effective at the next level. Weber and other schools recruit players who scored 20+ points a game in high school and don't do anything in college until their junior year.

Damian Lillard isn't the player he is today if not for assistant coaches helping him develop his skills. He credits coaches all the time for his development, whether they be Weber State coaches or otherwise.

I agree with you that more in state players would help with the in-state games due to wanting pride to win. But overall, I have no issues with recruiting out of state. Why limit yourself to one state?

I love the players from other states, but remember ... we are not getting the best players out of those states. Do you think for a minute that Joel would be here if Texas had offered him? Fact is we are getting players from other states who slip through the cracks. Out of state recruits view in state games as just another game.

 

[n.ogdencat]

The game was on a Sunday. Rahe has never won a game on Sunday. Why would it start now? I chalked this game up as a loss weeks ago. No way that Weber should have ever lost, but we did. Once again, to a highly inferior team.

 

[wazzuwildcat03]

Weber State has got to be the most frustrating team in the nation. :wall: After watching the game on Sunday I almost want to kill myself over this team and the decisions Coach Rahe makes. Denver is not that great. Sure they can make wide open 3's, but so can my church basketball team. We had a huge size advantage and superior athletes and we still got punked. A lot like the UVU game. Don't even get me started on UVU or I will probably puke on my computer. So when we got down 10 points in the first haft I noticed we went to a 3/2 defense to counter their ability to shoot the 3, and it takes away their back cuts. It also played into our hands because we were so much bigger and faster, etc then they were. It WORKED!!!! Please someone explain to me why in the hell did we not do that at all in the second half. Denver is a team we should beat like a drum by 20+ points. WTF. Is our coaching staff this stupid????? I used to worry that Coach Rahe would leave, but I would not mind a change. Rahe has done some good things here, but I think he has gotten us as far as he can take us which really isn't saying much considering how we have probably the best facilities of any mid major program. I know that the conference is what matters, but I just don't see it. I hope I'm wrong, but I would not bet on us on Friday to a team that lost at home to Idaho FREAKING State.

 

[STGWildcat]

I'll also mention Senglin here. He has scored more than 20 in a game consistently. Despite his weaknesses (turnovers), he can take over games at times. He almost pulled it off against Denver (Weber's final 11 points). If I'm the coaching staff, I'm trying to instill that kind of urgency in all my players for 40 minutes, not just in crunch time. Which would be more possible if Rahe used his bench more effectively (fresh legs).

Weber has more than enough talent. They just don't know how to use it.

Sorry, I don't buy it. So you define great recruiting as a player here and there who reaches that level? Sure Senglin has been a great college player but this team has been a revolving door of supposed great recruits. I define great recruiting as a team full of players who can execute a coaches vision. These coaches recruit great athletes and try to turn them into players.

3 years ago it was WSU's version of the "fab-five"... the greatest class ever by Rahe. And now Hunter, Richardson, and Jefferson can't even get in a game, and in my mind the verdict is still out on Braxton. Great recruits? or bring in tons of "athletes" until you find a diamond in the rough? What about all the great players that get away each year? To me a great recruiter brings in players that they see potential in and then develops that player into what they can become. Recruiting doesn't end with inking a scholarship.

Damian had the mind set to be great and these coaches allowed that to happen. I am just glad they did not screw it up.

Once the player is inked, I would consider the recruiting process complete. Why wouldn't it be? Once inked, recruiting that player is unnecessary at that point. Player development is the next step, which is where Rahe fails. He also fails at having his team prepared for games, and fails at making adjustments in game.

Whatever the case may be, and whatever technicalities we can come up with for one another, I'm ready for a change at the head coach position regardless of whether Rahe is a good recruiter or not. It's irrelevant at this point. Whether or not he's a good recruiter, it doesn't matter since he's not winning.

Other Big Sky schools are doing more with less. Montana State beats San Jose State on the road (not the greatest team, but a team Weber would lose to if UVU and Denver are any indication). Northern Colorado beats Colorado State handily despite being 13.5 underdogs going into the game. As much as we complain about the horrible conference (Big Sky), Weber State is just as much the problem right now.

 

[SWWeatherCat]

Weber State has got to be the most frustrating team in the nation.
So when we got down 10 points in the first haft I noticed we went to a 3/2 defense to counter their ability to shoot the 3, and it takes away their back cuts. It also played into our hands because we were so much bigger and faster, etc then they were. It WORKED!!!!

Noticed it, wondered the same damn thing, but quickly realized I'd seen this show before. Rahe is who he is and apparently his ceiling was reached years ago. UVU & DU night-and-day difference from Gulf Coast & BYU. I don't expect the Jekyll & Hide looks to be much different throughout BSC play.

 

[STGWildcat]

Why does everyone keep saying Rahe is such a great recruiter? We point out all the flaws in the team like coaches didn't get players ready, they made key turnovers, blah, blah, blah ... Maybe he should start recruiting a few players who can do those things on their own. Who care about in state games. Sure, coaching is a large part of it, but maybe the recruits aren't as great as everyone thinks?

Damian Lillard. Davion Berry. Joel Bolomboy. To name a few of his good recruits. Most high school players aren't fully developed. There's a reason most freshman ride the bench (excluding places like Kentucky where they get one-and-done four-star recruits). It takes time for them to become effective at the next level. Weber and other schools recruit players who scored 20+ points a game in high school and don't do anything in college until their junior year.

Damian Lillard isn't the player he is today if not for assistant coaches helping him develop his skills. He credits coaches all the time for his development, whether they be Weber State coaches or otherwise.

I agree with you that more in state players would help with the in-state games due to wanting pride to win. But overall, I have no issues with recruiting out of state. Why limit yourself to one state?

I love the players from other states, but remember ... we are not getting the best players out of those states. Do you think for a minute that Joel would be here if Texas had offered him? Fact is we are getting players from other states who slip through the cracks. Out of state recruits view in state games as just another game.

We aren't getting the best players out of Utah either. Most kids will sign with BYU, Utah, and Utah State before they'll consider Weber State. We may as well not limit ourselves to the Utah high schoolers who slip through the cracks. Using Bolomboy as an example, he's probably better than any player available in Utah at the time of recruiting him (after the three larger Utah schools got their pick of players). You increase your odds of finding diamonds in the rough if you recruit more than just Utah. I understand the in-state game dilemma though (lack of pride for out of state players).