Early Observations, Maybe Too Early

[oldrunner]

A team with really good potential has had a very poor start to the season.

The mess up in Logan was revealing. Our guys thought they could just show up and win the game, or at least that is what it looked like. I put that loss 50% on the team and 50% on the coaches. Since that flop, the team seems to lack confidence in what they are doing.

They need to get their swagger back.

Last year Senglin was given some time at the point and proved that he was not ready for it. This year he is playing mostly at the point and is still growing into that job. Our team is counting on him making that transition and , although it hasn't happened yet, I think he will. Right now, it's trial by fire.

I am not ready to throw in the towel on this team yet. The talent and potential is there. They just need to solve the turnover problem and start playing with confidence. :twocents:

 

[Midmajor??]

Olds...... A couple of points:

1) Turnovers have been a major issue. Between Senglin and Bolomboy every possession has been a roller coaster. Both are playing out of position and don't seem comfortable handling the ball. Hunter needs to run the offense and put the team in a position to win. They barely beat a Nevada team in one of our best games of the year. Nevada lost big to Nebraska- Omaha last night.

2) Beckner wasn't just a great development coach, he also held the players accountable. His move to the D league was a big loss for Weber. His impact could be seen for many years if we don't develop these younger players. I think Senglin and Gittens really miss him and could only wonder the impact he would've had on Golden and Hunter. We pride ourselves on recruiting and developing great athletes. Hill, Bolomboy and Senglin just seem raw. I hope that Braxton is getting the development he'll need as a big.

3) Bench isn't allowing Rahe to rest our starters. We don't have a bench that brings confidence. The production from Hajek, Hunter, Coston and Richardson is a major drop off and actually hurts Weber. Offensive production has been at best 3-4 PTs a game. Our starters look tired in the 2nd half!

We will look better in conference, because our conference doesn't strike fear in competitors hearts. This could be a down year for Weber State. Hate to say rebuilding year, but if the turnovers don't improve and the interior defense tightens up, it could be a very long year.

 

[catscratched]

Beckner's leaving is not the problem. Smiley is just as good or better at developing skills in players, and he has a much more positive approach to it.

The bench is coming along. I don't see that as the biggest problem either.

That leaves turnovers, rebounding, and defense. Crack those nuts and you crack the season.

 

[WeberSki]

Olds...... A couple of points:

1) Turnovers have been a major issue. Between Senglin and Bolomboy every possession has been a roller coaster. Both are playing out of position and don't seem comfortable handling the ball. Hunter needs to run the offense and put the team in a position to win. They barely beat a Nevada team in one of our best games of the year. Nevada lost big to Nebraska- Omaha last night.

2) Beckner wasn't just a great development coach, he also held the players accountable. His move to the D league was a big loss for Weber. His impact could be seen for many years if we don't develop these younger players. I think Senglin and Gittens really miss him and could only wonder the impact he would've had on Golden and Hunter. We pride ourselves on recruiting and developing great athletes. Hill, Bolomboy and Senglin just seem raw. I hope that Braxton is getting the development he'll need as a big.

3) Bench isn't allowing Rahe to rest our starters. We don't have a bench that brings confidence. The production from Hajek, Hunter, Coston and Richardson is a major drop off and actually hurts Weber. Offensive production has been at best 3-4 PTs a game. Our starters look tired in the 2nd half!

We will look better in conference, because our conference doesn't strike fear in competitors hearts. This could be a down year for Weber State. Hate to say rebuilding year, but if the turnovers don't improve and the interior defense tightens up, it could be a very long year.

1) Omaha beat Marquette, they also lost to Nebraska by 10 or so in Lincoln. Marquette beat Georgia tech, and played Ohio St., and Michigan St. fairly tough.

2) Beckner's loss is not hurting Weber's program whatsoever. Way too negative to the players. Glad he's moved on. You're giving him way too much credit.

3) Senglin will figure it out.

 

[Da Bears]

Beckner's leaving is not the problem. Smiley is just as good or better at developing skills in players, and he has a much more positive approach to it.

The bench is coming along. I don't see that as the biggest problem either.

That leaves turnovers, rebounding, and defense. Crack those nuts and you crack the season.

Bench coming together? I must've missed a game! I don't think Senglin is the answer at PG.

 

[baller]

Here's my take:
Senglin is not now nor will he ever be a great point. He will learn to be OK as far as the level of competition in the Big Sky is concerned. But will struggle against higher caliber opponents.

Senglin is a very good player who is playing out of position. For that matter so is Gittens playing out of position. He got schooled pretty regularly in the Paradise Jam by guys playing the wing position at 6'5" - 6'8". He is barely 6'3"'s and should be a shooting guard. But he can't be effective offensively at that until he improves his shooting ability. He has made no progress at that since last year. Finally, Bolomboy is also out of position.

Weber can compete at the Big Sky level with the current out-of-position arrangement but not at a higher level. The Paradise Jam showed that. I was there and watched all the games live and I can say that Weber has the talent already to compete with the big boys if they would just put every one in their natural positions and find a big center and a big wing there would be no stopping them.

I haven't been Raye's most avid fan. But after watching all the coaches in the Jam I am here to tell you that Raye is better than most as a coach. LSU had enough talent on their team to out talent an all-star team made up of the 10 best players of all the other teams in the tournament. But their coach was an embarrassment. They had the talent but they were not the team because their coach sucked.

Senglin got better at the point during the tournament. In those three games his assist outnumbered his turnovers by a 1.5 to 1 margin. For him, that is vast improvement. I could see his confidence grow in the three games. He was one of the better players in the tournament and will be a force for Weber over the next 2.5 years. Hunter has some talent but it seems to me that he is too slow to compete against high-level competition at the point. He will be OK in the sky however. Will be a nice player for Weber over the coming years. I think they should be playing him at the point now and Senglin at the 2.

If we are going to take the next step of winning the Sky and getting better than a 15 seed in the NCAA's we have to have more size. More size at center, more size at the wing and play others at their natural position.
Medium to high-level teams are playing 6'10"+ centers, 6'8"+ pf's, 6'6"+ wings, 6'4"+ two's and very quick and athletic point guards. We just don't match up against that kind of a lineup at this time. Maybe next year, using the redshirts and the freshman, we can do it.

But we will be in the competition to win the Sky this year, who will get a 15 or 16 seed and lose in the first round probably without being very competitive in that game.

 

[catscratched]

Our bench is two freshmen and a senior. We don't need our senior to score a lot, but we do need him to rebound and play D. I think that he is doing OK there. The two freshmen are getting experience and becoming more comfortable.

A move that I would like to see is moving Hill to the 3 and Gittens to the 2, while bringing Golden off the bench for a little more firepower from the bench. That would leave a decision on starting Hajek or Coston. My choice would be Hajek. Instead of worrying about matching up with other BSC teams, we should make them worry about matching up with us. Why wait for next year to make this move? Make it now and we will be that much better next year. :twocents:

 

[Da Bears]

Our bench is two freshmen and a senior. We don't need our senior to score a lot, but we do need him to rebound and play D. I think that he is doing OK there. The two freshmen are getting experience and becoming more comfortable.

A move that I would like to see is moving Hill to the 3 and Gittens to the 2, while bringing Golden off the bench for a little more firepower from the bench. That would leave a decision on starting Hajek or Coston. My choice would be Hajek. Instead of worrying about matching up with other BSC teams, we should make them worry about matching up with us. Why wait for next year to make this move? Make it now and we will be that much better next year. :twocents:

Our bench is a senior, junior , and two freshman. How do you move Gittens to the 2 if he can't hit jumpers? I agree with putting Hill at 3 and having either Gittens or Golden at 2. I'd like to see Hajek start at 5 and move Bolomboy back to 4. Coston isn't tall enough to play 5...... He even struggles at 4.
Everyone feels like we'll be fine once conference play starts. I have a surprise for you..... The BSC is going to improve every year. We might be lucky to be 4th place this year. I wouldn't count on us winning the conference this year.

 

[catscratched]

The junior is the 9th guy and I'm not counting him as the bench just yet. I would put the top rebounding team on the floor and worry about the outside shooting after that. I don't see a difference between Hill's outside shooting and Gittens'. If you were to move Bolomboy to the 4, he is an adequate 3 point shooter. I would love to see a shooter like Golden coming off the bench to go against the other teams reserve player. I think that he might be more productive in that role. Just a thought. :twocents:

 

[Midmajor??]

The junior is the 9th guy and I'm not counting him as the bench just yet. I would put the top rebounding team on the floor and worry about the outside shooting after that. I don't see a difference between Hill's outside shooting and Gittens'. If you were to move Bolomboy to the 4, he is an adequate 3 point shooter. I would love to see a shooter like Golden coming off the bench to go against the other teams reserve player. I think that he might be more productive in that role. Just a thought. :twocents:

I had Richardson as the 9th guy....... Coston as 8th. Neither of them have contributed much. I agree that Golden might help us off the bench. I was thinking about next year. Do we have the same starting 5? I'm not sure we'll be that much better! Still 3-4 guys playing out of position. We are only losing Hajek, could lose a couple more over playing time. Maybe the rebuilding stuff is just a myth. There still be guys playing out of position.

 

[catscratched]

I agree, Midmajor. Reposition the guys now. It won't hurt this season at all, and will be a big help next year. Also, bring in an assistant coach who knows haw to run a zone D or two. We need a bit of diversity on D. :twocents:

 

[catscratched]

I had Richardson as the 9th guy until recently. Now I think they are sharing that spot and will see limited action from here on out.

 

[WSUProf]

Our bench is two freshmen and a senior. We don't need our senior to score a lot, but we do need him to rebound and play D. I think that he is doing OK there. The two freshmen are getting experience and becoming more comfortable.

A move that I would like to see is moving Hill to the 3 and Gittens to the 2, while bringing Golden off the bench for a little more firepower from the bench. That would leave a decision on starting Hajek or Coston. My choice would be Hajek. Instead of worrying about matching up with other BSC teams, we should make them worry about matching up with us. Why wait for next year to make this move? Make it now and we will be that much better next year. :twocents:

Hajek - Senior
Johnson-Coston -Junior (JC transfer)
Hunter -Freshman
These are the 3 who have consistently come off the bench so far this year.

 

[oldrunner]

Actually, Johnson-Coston is about the same thing as a freshman. Our two JC transfers have not adjusted to D1 ball as fast as we would have liked. That often happens with JCs. They really could have used a red shirt year. However, you usually don't bring in a JC player to red shirt.

It is not time to throw out the bath water, and certainly not with the baby in it. I believe that our coaches are thinking of all the same things we are. The difference is that they are with the team every day and we see them once or twice a week, at most.

My feeling is that the lineup is likely to change at least once before January and maybe again after that.

Stay tuned. It's going to be an interesting season.

 

[WSUfan4ever]

We definitely need to make some adjustments.

Size (or lack thereof) at the 2-3-4 positions is hurting us when we go up against top quality teams. When you look at the combined stats of the Paradise Jam games alone they are very revealing. Total rebounds WSU – 79, opponents – 111. Defensive rebounds were at least respectable at 56 -61. It was offensive rebounds where we got killed at 23 – 50. This resulted in extra shots for every team we played. It was hard to watch games because of the stupid web broadcasts, but from what I did see there were two things going on: 1) our guards were getting beat off the dribble which put the bigs in help defense and out of position for DR’s, and 2) the players at the 2-3-4 struggled to rebound against bigger players. It would be very interesting to watch the films and break down which players were not getting DR’s that turned into OR’s for the other teams. Bolomboy, Hill and Hayek did the rebounding job when they were in position. The problems were with a host of other players. Let’s use Richardson more. Yes, he is a freshman and he will make mistakes but he has size to help with the rebounding issue. The size issue is also certainly hurting us on defense, too.

Turnovers were 59 – 44 in favor of the opponents. This needs to improve as everyone has pointed out. If we are going to play a smaller lineup we had better win this stat every single game. Totally agree that Joel should be the 4, Hill the 3, Gittens the 2 where he is not giving up 4-6” to everyone he comes up against … not sure what that means at the 5. Hayek does not score but he is not anyway now coming off the bench. He should be playing with the players who can carry the scoring load so he can rebound and protect the paint. Golden and Hunter off the bench makes a lot of sense. Coston has been a non-factor so far, maybe he just needs time? I am not so sure. His size seems to limit his potential, and he just doesn’t play big. Also, not sure what this leaves for our bench, but who cares? Our bench is averaging what, 6 points a game? Let’s mix things up. It can’t be any worse than it is now.

 

[Da Bears]

I thought it was stated in a different post that coach Rahe wanted to go smallet to compete against smaller teams? Don't we need to go small to compete in the BSC?

 

[WSUfan4ever]

Not sure, is that truly what Rahe said? If that is the case then I hope we start to see some improvement from the "small" lineup soon. Conference play is a month away and I am struggling to see how this will all come together. Do we go small to match up with the BSC? Or do we play to the best of our strengths (whatever that is) and make everyone match up to us? I know the coaches have a plan but so far the road is very bumpy.

 

[Itiger]

Not sure, is that truly what Rahe said? If that is the case then I hope we start to see some improvement from the "small" lineup soon. Conference play is a month away and I am struggling to see how this will all come together. Do we go small to match up with the BSC? Or do we play to the best of our strengths (whatever that is) and make everyone match up to us? I know the coaches have a plan but so far the road is very bumpy.

It was something Olds told us that Randy wanted to do to improve match ups inside the BSC. I agree... Rather make someone match up to us.

 

[Webergrad02]

Olds...... A couple of points:

1) Turnovers have been a major issue. Between Senglin and Bolomboy every possession has been a roller coaster. Both are playing out of position and don't seem comfortable handling the ball. Hunter needs to run the offense and put the team in a position to win. They barely beat a Nevada team in one of our best games of the year. Nevada lost big to Nebraska- Omaha last night.

2) Beckner wasn't just a great development coach, he also held the players accountable. His move to the D league was a big loss for Weber. His impact could be seen for many years if we don't develop these younger players. I think Senglin and Gittens really miss him and could only wonder the impact he would've had on Golden and Hunter. We pride ourselves on recruiting and developing great athletes. Hill, Bolomboy and Senglin just seem raw. I hope that Braxton is getting the development he'll need as a big.

3) Bench isn't allowing Rahe to rest our starters. We don't have a bench that brings confidence. The production from Hajek, Hunter, Coston and Richardson is a major drop off and actually hurts Weber. Offensive production has been at best 3-4 PTs a game. Our starters look tired in the 2nd half!

We will look better in conference, because our conference doesn't strike fear in competitors hearts. This could be a down year for Weber State. Hate to say rebuilding year, but if the turnovers don't improve and the interior defense tightens up, it could be a very long year.

1) Omaha beat Marquette, they also lost to Nebraska by 10 or so in Lincoln. Marquette beat Georgia tech, and played Ohio St., and Michigan St. fairly tough.

2) Beckner's loss is not hurting Weber's program whatsoever. Way too negative to the players. Glad he's moved on. You're giving him way too much credit.

3) Senglin will figure it out.

1) You can share comparative scores all day long and they don't tell the whole story. Nevada is not a great team, so what. We are not the great team we thought we would be.

2) There is a reason why Dame works out with Beckner a time or two in the offseason. It is not because he was a worthless coach. I think the coaching transition may be an adjustment for the team. I think we will be fine.

3) I hope the bench can give our core guys a break.

 

[WSUfan4ever]

Beckner must have been doing something right to be coaching in the D League right now. However, from what I have heard he was a lightning rod, kids either loved him or hated him. But either way he required everyone to perform and held them accountable. Either way he is gone now so I am hoping the team responds to a very different coaching style. The jury is still out.