Idaho to join Sun Belt for football...

[PBP]

Idaho Statesmen reporting that UI will ask the SBOE for permission later this week to join the Sun Belt for football if they get a bid (apparently it's expected...)

Very, very surprised at this. The Sun Belt is a mediocre, shaky league to start with, they are going to have a large cost for travel but the Sun Belt at least is a 'big time' football league (FBS) and apparently that's all they care about up there (at least the powers that be...)

I just don't understand their obsession with being "big time" in football. Especially when their program has been miserable for the better part of two decades since they originally left the Big Sky is an effort to keep up with Boise State. The Sun Belt also isn't going to get an massive amounts of bowl money either, maybe they are so desperate financially that anything is important to them.

Oh well, it's their bed now.

When the new schools join, the Sun Belt will have a 12-member football and basketball conference. Full members will be Appalachian State, Arkansas State, Georgia Southern, Georgia State, Louisiana-Lafayette, Louisiana-Monroe, South Alabama, Texas State, Troy and Western Kentucky.

Idaho and New Mexico State will be football-only members. Arkansas-Little Rock and Texas-Arlington will be full members in all sports except football.

The Sun Belt sought new teams after losing Florida Atlantic, Florida International, North Texas and Middle Tennessee to Conference USA.

In a way I'm glad. This can end the speculation with the Big Sky and the conference can now move on to getting that 14th member, split into divisions and potentially have that championship game for the NCAA bid.

PBP

 

[notabengalalum]

Another geographically confused school. Sun Belt? From the old days of the original Sun Belt, I think South Alabama is the only leftover.
App State and Georgia Southern are jumping out of the FCS (I-AA) and taking two very good football programs into the FBS. That certainly is not going to help the FCS Southern Conference. What I will bet is that either one of those programs can make the Vandals look ridiculously bad.

 

[Skippy]

The future of the FCS is a bit shaky, with a lot of its best programs choosing to move up. I understand why Idaho would be hesitant to drop back down after making the move. Whether they can be successful remains to be seen.

Will be interesting to see if the Big Sky takes the plunge now and brings in a 14th school for football.

 

[PBP]

Skippy is right in the sense that the embargo is over so schools can now move up, Villanova and Richmond are also rumored to be looking to go up in competition. However if you notice all of those schools are in the East / Southeast.

I don't know of any schools west of the Mississippi, particularly the Big Sky, now looking to make a move with the demise of the WAC. Certainly the Pac-12 and the Mountain West aren't looking at them.

Personally I think the Big Sky is on very solid ground both on and of the field.

I suspect the Big Sky will try to make a move sooner rather than later but honestly who would be a possibility especially since it would only be for football.

Any names out there to speculate on Brad?

PBP

 

[otis campbell]

What's in a name? Sun Belt Conference, Leftover Conference, Irrelevant Conference, Gottabesomething Conference, Whatever Conference. Amazing, and less than 10 miles from the PAC 12 doormat. From a perennial FCS powerhouse to this.

 

[sasquatch]

Where do you get a 14th member from? The only team left in the west is San Diego, and they're non-scholarship. Does a D2 move up? Can a school like UVU or a Big West type school be convinced to add or reinstate a program?

FCS will continue to exist, but it might lose whatever national relevance it had. In the west, I'd say we won't notice much of a difference since there really aren't many schools currently at that level anyway.

 

[PBP]

Utah Valley has been socking away a million dollars a year for about a decade now to be ready to start a football program. They have told the Big Sky they'd start a program tomorrow if invited to join, however I've been told a number of presidents do not want them because of their lower academic standards.

They would clearly be the choice geographically if the Big Sky wanted to add that final member.

A D-II school moving up is something I hadn't thought of, guess that's a possibility as well.

PBP

 

[Skippy]

The problem now is that you have 14 basketball teams now with the addition of Idaho, so if you add a school it would likely have to be football-only. And I would think UVU would only come in if all their programs were accepted. Then you'd have to find another basketball program to get back to an even number. Could happen, but after talking with Jeff Tingey on the coach's show last week, it sounds like the conference is happy where it is right now.

 

[biobengal]

With Georgia Southern and Appalachian State joining the Sun Belt Montana has taken notice. O'day on record as saying the brand has been damaged. Montana and Montana State are on the clock, maybe even UC Davis and Cal Poly. We'll see, for Idaho State it will be a bumpy ride.

http://mobile.dudamobile.com/site/makeitmissoula?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.makeitmissoula.com%2F2013%2F04%2Fmore-realignment-changes-taking-major-toll-on-fcs-football%2F#2794" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[SLCBengal]

They're not located in the west, but East Tennessee State announced they are bringing back football to the FCS level. They dropped it about 10 years for financial concerns.

Interestingly enough, they will pursue a new stadium, rather than playing in their dome. If you've ever seen their dome, you know that it was modeled after Holt...

There also is the question regarding where the team will play. Last week, (ETSU President) Noland said the Mountain States Health Alliance Athletic Center , also known as the “Mini-Dome,” will not house the new edition of Buccaneer football.

Read more: TriCities.com: ETSU Targets Fall of 2015 to Field Football Team

 

[Skippy]

With Georgia Southern and Appalachian State joining the Sun Belt Montana has taken notice. O'day on record as saying the brand has been damaged. Montana and Montana State are on the clock, maybe even UC Davis and Cal Poly. We'll see, for Idaho State it will be a bumpy ride.

http://mobile.dudamobile.com/site/makeitmissoula?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.makeitmissoula.com%2F2013%2F04%2Fmore-realignment-changes-taking-major-toll-on-fcs-football%2F#2794" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

They may be on the clock, but the question is, "to where?" Unless the Mountain West gets the itch to add teams (and more mouths to feed from the conference television and NCAA tournament trough), there is nowhere for western schools to migrate to become D-1, now that the WAC has given up football. The alternative would be for "move up" schools to create their own western conference: Idaho, the two Montanas, Sac, Portland, maybe. It would be a hard climb, but not inconceiveable.

 

[JJB]

Skippy is correct, assuming everything remains stable and as-is. Currently, a school can only make a move up to FBS if it is invited by an FBS conference. As we have seen over the last few years, conference realignment moves fast and with many twists and surprises. The Big XII still sits at 10 schools. Sooner or later, it may look to expand and catch up in numbers with the Big Ten, Pac-12, or SEC. They may grab from the ACC or Big East, but there are always some MWC teams from which to choose. Boise and San Diego State have already shown us that they care more about chasing the money than maintaining traditional and regional rivals. Who knows, maybe the Sun Belt decides to push on to 14 or 16 schools and establishes a trust east/west split. I will say that if the MWC finds itself in the position of inviting schools, Montana will receive an invitation before Idaho.

I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for schools in the west to reinstate football. Long Beach State, Fullerton State, and Northridge State are among those who do have behind the scenes groups trying to re-establish football at the FCS level. None have had much luck thus far, although LBSU did bring it to a student vote two years ago. It failed, 52% to 48%, give or take. Many were surprised at the narrow margin, considering the state of the economy and the mess California always seems to find itself in. If any of those three can manage to get some big money donors on board, it may happen. Unfortunately, that's the wish of every low to mid major school.

 

[boisebengal]

Also Abilene Christian University has discussed the possibility of moving up to 1-AA, as has Minnesota State-Mankato. And who knows, it could be a matter of time before Dixie State could make the move. The Big Sky really does need some more 1-AA teams to play out here in the West, or else all the Big Sky teams could very well regularly play D-II and NAIA teams on their non-conference schedule.

I can't figure out why Idaho is so hell-bent and insistent on competing at the 1-A level, perhaps it's the prestige at playing at that level -- I don't know. But in a way, I do respect their efforts to wish to play at that level, if that's what they want. Even if it does mean playing in a watered-down Sun Belt league with no potential for them to have any rivalry games, like they would if they were to compete in the Big Sky. I'd like to see the attendance figures that Idaho will have at home when they play teams like Georgia State and Louisiana-Monroe. If Idaho still considers BSU to be their rival, then I will say that BSU refuses to play the Vandals in the next several years -- what good would it do for BSU to play them?

Although one advantage for Idaho to play at the 1-A level is that they would command more money for playing body-bag games against teams from major conferences than Big Sky teams could. Although the amount differential isn't near enough to offset the total costs at competing in all sports at the 1-A level relative to competing at the 1-AA level.

When Karl Benson was commisioner of the WAC he invited Idaho into the mix as an act of desperation so that that league would have enough teams to have a conference. And now it seems as if he's doing the same thing as commissioner of the Sun Belt. In the next few years I'm thinking there would be more and more teams leaving the Sun Belt for C-USA, when more conference structuring will occur. Idaho's only hope would eventually to be invited into the MWC, but that won't happen anytime soon, if ever.

 

[PBP]

Boise:

It's my understanding that there is a group of the fan base including some prominent boosters who are "insisting" that Idaho play at the "highest level" of football.

I guess if you consider Louisiana-Monroe, Louisiana-Lafayette, South Alabama and Texas State the "highest" level, then they have gotten their wish.

I agree it makes no sense to me and I suspect Benson is the driving force behind this. But if that's what they want then they'll have to accept the consequences both good and bad for their decision.

Geographically, logically and historically Idaho belongs in the Big Sky Conference and who knows, with the changing shape of the conference landscape literally almost every day. who knows where the Sun Belt could be a month from now, a year from now, three years from now? Idaho might still want to / have to come back to the Big Sky.

The fascinating question then would be after all this screwing around with them, would the Big Sky still say yes?

PBP

 

[pocatato]

What is the posibility of the Big Sky moving up to a hybrid BCS type league? Is this feasible? Is it smart? Where would the money come from?

 

[PBP]

Poc:

I think you answered your own question with "where would the money come from..." It wouldn't be coming so this is highly, highly unlikely.

Most Big Sky schools simply come not afford to come up with the money needed to move up. Not going to happen.

PBP

 

[Spudhead]

The Idaho athletic director and others have predicted that the top 5 conferences will pull out of the NCAA or at least form a new division. He has said that the remaining conferences like the Sun Belt, MAC, MWC, and Conference USA will form a new division with some FCS schools. Do you think that's possible? If it is, would the Big Sky be able to move up in that scenario?

 

[pocatato]

PBP, I guess I was just thinking out loud. Or maybe not thinking at all.

 

[PBP]

Sin:

You are talking about the 'superconferences' which a number of big time coaches like Nick Saban and John Calipari have said publicly are coming and sooner rather than later.

I certainly agree with that prediction. The top 60 or so schools are going to form their own division, tell the NCAA to take a hike and keep all of the money earned from sports like football and men's basketball. There is also a good possibility that they are going to pay athletes a certain amount of money in that division.

I don't think it's a question of 'moving up' for conferences like the Big Sky, joining (in so many words) with conferences like the Sun Belt say. I think it will be more of a situation where everyone else is going to be in the same boat, probably under a denuded body like what remains of the NCAA. Those schools are going to have to redefine the ground rules, scholarship limitations, try to get some type of TV contract with someone and decide if they want to keep a 'playoff system'.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I don't think it will be a case of the Big Sky 'moving up' as it will be of everyone that remains 'moving down' based specifically because the money isn't going to be there (say from TV revenue) to enable a mix to form a third division (between the superconferences and the schools that are now in the FCS)

I think the superconferences form within the next five years myself, so ironically Idaho isn't going to remain in the 'big time' of college football for long.

We'll see.

Lip

 

[Bandit]

Abilene Christian University has moved up to 1-AA in basketball, but I am not sure about football. It seems like they would. I am familiar with Jake Lancaster from NJC, and he has signed with them and I understood that he said it was 1-AA. Now, his signing is to play basketball. I think Pearce from NJC is visiting there this coming week. Again for basketball and not football. It is interesting to read what you guys are saying, because I don't have much savy about all the conferences.