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North Dakota in Big Sky Conference question?

wazzuwildcat03

Active member
I was just wondering why UND is even in the Big Sky? I have nothing against them, but just seems that it would have made sense for them to be in the same conference as the other Dakota schools. If I could have it my way I would drop them and add a school like UC Davis in all sports. I know UC Davis is in for football only, but geographically it just makes more sense. The North Dakota campus is almost in friggin Minnesota. I feel bad that they have to travel so far for pretty much any conference game. I would really like to know why they even wanted a part of the Big Sky when the Summit is a much more logically choice in my opinion.

Traveling partners would be
Montana
Montana St.

Idaho
Idaho St.

UC Davis
Sac St.

Weber State
SUU

Portland State
EWU

NAU
UNC This pairing makes the least sense, but not too weird.
 
Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought we were going to get another Dakota school that pulled out at the last minute.

I like having them. They have strong fan support and decent venues. UND is a stronger program throughout all sports than UC Davis.
 
I think there was some backroom politicking going on between the Dakota’s and the Summit Conference. Summit didn’t want UND or USD until the BSC came knocking. I thought the UND/USD was going to be a package deal but the Summit swooped in and offered USD a spot so hence no travel partner for UND. In hindsight it worked out for the better for the BSC. USD has some horrible facilities (another dome for football…yuck) and doesn’t have anywhere near the level of budgeting for athletics that UND has. Maybe a trolling UND poster can provide more accurate details.

Fast forward to July 1st 2014 and the BSC will find itself with a nice 12 member conference (Idaho comes on board) with somewhat regional travel partners. Sure that UND-UNC travel blows, but the trade off is a busable travel leg on the EWU-UI, ISU-WSU, UM-MSU trips, a manageable PSU-Sac trip and a delirious NAU-SUU trip. Moving to divisions for some of the other sports will further reduce travel demands.

The CP and davis FB only additions were moves by Foolerton to block potential WAC desperation expansion as Benson drove that conference into the ground. I do wish Foolerton would have kept with the “all or nothing” member status. He fvcked us pretty good with those later exceptions. :thumbdown:
 
I also remember something like one of the conditions to North Dakota getting into the Summit was getting rid of the Sioux nickname, and then once the Big Sky pushed forward an invitation, North Dakota cancelled all meeting and talks with the Summit League. Turns out thanks to some tightwads in the NCAA UND was forced to get rid of the nickname anyway.

In a year of College Landscape Uncertainty, sacrifices needed to be made. I was fine with the addition of Cal Poly and Davis as football only members especially considering at the time it looked like the WAC was trying very hard to poach the Montana's from the Big Sky. After that all that was left in the Great West was SUU, UND and USD. So the invitation was sent to the last 3 and they all were going to join but the Summit League who now only wanted USD snuck in and sniped them away.

The Big Sky footprint is pretty Big right now this is true, however the Conference is very stable right now and no one other than maybe Idaho is looking for a new conference to call home. And we all know that Idaho is only using the Big Sky as a crutch till they can eventually get into the Mountain West :roll:
 
Idaho will be on crutches long enough that they might just as well order up the wheel chair. The MWC would already like to get rid of Wyoming. Why would they want to bring in another one just like them. USU got lucky in a lot of ways. UM would have a higher chance of getting a bid for the MWC than UI. It won't happen any time soon, if at all.
 
Doubt the MWC wants either of those 2. In this modern era of conference realignment where the only things that matter are media size and recruitment hotbeds, neither of those two offer anything in those emphasized areas. So UM and UI aren’t going anywhere anytime soon…if ever.
 
As much as I agree that Idaho will never get a MWC invite unless something catastrophic happens to that conf, you know as soon as Idaho get an opening for something "better" they will bolt.
 
WILDCAT said:
As much as I agree that Idaho will never get a MWC invite unless something catastrophic happens to that conf, you know as soon as Idaho get an opening for something "better" they will bolt.

Thing is, they won't. :lol: :lol:
 
PURPLEFORLIFE said:
WILDCAT said:
As much as I agree that Idaho will never get a MWC invite unless something catastrophic happens to that conf, you know as soon as Idaho get an opening for something "better" they will bolt.

Thing is, they won't. :lol: :lol:


True :lol:
 
IU is still butt hurt of BSU's success so soon after leaving the JC ranks. Idaho and Idaho State were always the big dogs of the potato state untill those uppity BSU folks burst onto the scene. Football and more TV sets is what catapulted BSU to where they are now. The former big dogs just don't have the market. USU would be in the same boat if it wasn't for an involved alumni, an active/captive student body, and tradition.

Idaho has nothing to offer but good academics and great grad programs. other than that, they have a few skin head encampments to draw fans from. :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
SDHornet said:
I think there was some backroom politicking going on between the Dakota’s and the Summit Conference. Summit didn’t want UND or USD until the BSC came knocking. I thought the UND/USD was going to be a package deal but the Summit swooped in and offered USD a spot so hence no travel partner for UND. In hindsight it worked out for the better for the BSC. USD has some horrible facilities (another dome for football…yuck) and doesn’t have anywhere near the level of budgeting for athletics that UND has. Maybe a trolling UND poster can provide more accurate details.

Fast forward to July 1st 2014 and the BSC will find itself with a nice 12 member conference (Idaho comes on board) with somewhat regional travel partners. Sure that UND-UNC travel blows, but the trade off is a busable travel leg on the EWU-UI, ISU-WSU, UM-MSU trips, a manageable PSU-Sac trip and a delirious NAU-SUU trip. Moving to divisions for some of the other sports will further reduce travel demands.

The CP and davis FB only additions were moves by Foolerton to block potential WAC desperation expansion as Benson drove that conference into the ground. I do wish Foolerton would have kept with the “all or nothing” member status. He fvcked us pretty good with those later exceptions. :thumbdown:


South Dakota was already accepted in the Summit, but weren't in the MVFC for football. When UND and USD were announced as a pair to the Big Sky, the Summit Conference sh*t their pants, as they were expected UND too but held the nickname over us to prevent us from joining. USD would have had to pay the Summit $250,000 to leave, even though they hadn't played a game yet. SDSU, NDSU, and WIll lobbied the MVFC to accept USD, so when that happened, USD took the MVFC option and turned down the Big Sky.

USD is a facility poor school in the extreme SE corner of SD. They are getting a new BB arena, but everything other sport plays in the DakotaDome, which is a 12,000 seat dome built in 1970 the make ISU's UniDone seem like a Taj Mahal. UND and USD would have made bad travel partners, because USD is nearly 400 miles away by interstate. Try traveling down I-29 in winter months with icy condition or blizzard warnings. Kids could have been stuck on the S Dakota prairies for days trying to get out. USD is in a town of 8000 people, so there's not an airport or much of anything. South Dakota has traditionally not placed an emphasis on secondary schools, so with the lack of money USD did what it could and chose the cheapest route.

UND has put in $220 million in athletic facilities prior to going DI, and we are now building a $18 mill indoor practice / 200 m track facility for football, track. soccer. With the exception of baseball, softball, and women's soccer, our facilities are top of the line. Our men's hockey team is 7 time DI champs and we've been to the DI Frozen Four umpteen times. Attracting 250,000 a year at $30 a pop, hockey pays a lot of bills.

With North Dakota's economy booming (has doubled in the past 10 years), ND is a place to go if you want a job. The state has bundles of money and just awarded UND a new shiny med school building and expanded the law school. Business and engineering are fast growing majors and almost every one has multiple offers out of school (a petroleum engineer gets at least a $100 k job right out of school).

The Summit wants us, but we want the Big Sky. About 20% of the school is devoted to aerospace and training pilots, so its not like we have an aversion to plane travel and airlines. UNC is a much easier travel companion that USD. UNC is a traditional rival of UND, so there isn't a complaint here.

Fullerton made noise about attracting NDSU, SDSU, and USD to the Big Sky when the Big Sky meetings were held in Grand Forks two weeks ago. He has plans for FBS level football. I think USD, NDSU, and SDSU would be interested in an FBS Big Sky.
 
The Big Sky being an FBS conference for football is a pipe dream right now. Few of our programs would meet their minimum home attendance guidelines.

I personally don't mind having UND in the Big Sky. If North Dakota has so much money, why not pay your coaches more. Pretty sad when those engineers are making more than your head basketball coach. I personally don't think Jones deserves a raise but it would be nice to get a decent coach once he is fired. Some of us were joking at the conference tournament that Jones looks the part of the lowest paid coach in the league. He wore the same wrinkled gray suit each game and it looked like he hadn't shaved all week. Usually coaches try to look good when they are playing for a championship on national tv.

We need another school willing to pay to have and keep a good coach. I am convinced that coaching stability is the single greatest factor for a mid-major program to be successful.
 
webergrad02 said:
The Big Sky being an FBS conference for football is a pipe dream right now. Few of our programs would meet their minimum home attendance guidelines. ]

The plan with Idaho was always to make the Big Sky FBS. UC Davis, Sac St, Cal Poly, Montana, MSU, Portland St, and UND want it to happen. UC Davis and Cal Poly were promised the Big Sky would work toward FBS, otherwise those two would have probably joined the WAC. Idaho playing in the Sun Belt won't work long term. With enough members, an FCS league can be sponsored too by the Big Sky (may UNC, NAU, Idaho St, Weber, SUU, and affiliates San Diego or South Dakota stay FCS).

I personally don't mind having UND in the Big Sky. If North Dakota has so much money, why not pay your coaches more. Pretty sad when those engineers are making more than your head basketball coach. I personally don't think Jones deserves a raise but it would be nice to get a decent coach once he is fired. Some of us were joking at the conference tournament that Jones looks the part of the lowest paid coach in the league. He wore the same wrinkled gray suit each game and it looked like he hadn't shaved all week. Usually coaches try to look good when they are playing for a championship on national tv.

We need another school willing to pay to have and keep a good coach. I am convinced that coaching stability is the single greatest factor for a mid-major program to be successful.
Our men's BB coach is low in the totem pole for salary: our men's hockey coach, women's hockey, football, women's basketball, and volleyball coach all make more than Jones . Its not like Weber where men's basketball is your top sport. Jones was hired when we had a tight wad AD transitioning to DI. IMHO, he's not that popular in the community or with the big donors and he really hasn't proven himself yet. But why he hasn't gotten a substantial raise from his DII salary is an open question. We hired a former Tennessee assistant last year, and got one from Montana St this year, so I wouldn't be surprised if the assistants make almost as much as Jones.
 
SDHornet said:
I think there was some backroom politicking going on between the Dakota’s and the Summit Conference. Summit didn’t want UND or USD until the BSC came knocking. I thought the UND/USD was going to be a package deal but the Summit swooped in and offered USD a spot so hence no travel partner for UND. In hindsight it worked out for the better for the BSC. USD has some horrible facilities (another dome for football…yuck) and doesn’t have anywhere near the level of budgeting for athletics that UND has. Maybe a trolling UND poster can provide more accurate details.

Fast forward to July 1st 2014 and the BSC will find itself with a nice 12 member conference (Idaho comes on board) with somewhat regional travel partners. Sure that UND-UNC travel blows, but the trade off is a busable travel leg on the EWU-UI, ISU-WSU, UM-MSU trips, a manageable PSU-Sac trip and a delirious NAU-SUU trip. Moving to divisions for some of the other sports will further reduce travel demands.

The CP and davis FB only additions were moves by Foolerton to block potential WAC desperation expansion as Benson drove that conference into the ground. I do wish Foolerton would have kept with the “all or nothing” member status. He fvcked us pretty good with those later exceptions. :thumbdown:

Since the Big Sky has started to allow Football only memberships, I wonder when Sac is going to court the Big West for an invite. Wouldn't that be a better fit, SD Hornet?
 
Yes, but the more relevant question is will the BSC want to let its only CA member leave? I doubt any BSC member wants to lose in-roads to any NorCal recruiting.

And if we were to leave my preference would be WAC membership over BW membership. :twocents:
 

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