Questions about Baldwin from a Cal Bear

[TheGreatOski]

Hi Eagles fans-
I’m a Cal fan and wanted to come here to learn more about your former coach Baldwin (and Edwards).

When we first hired him, many felt pretty bullish about him given his record. In the 2 seasons we’ve had him, we haven’t had a very successful offense nor have we seen much growth and progression.

My intent isn’t to lay blame. It’s clear we have a defensive identity which makes sense given Wilcox and his past. It’s pretty clear we’ve been pretty conservative on offense since our talent is on the other side of the ball. We’re also generally lacking star talent on offense.

Still, many Can fans are disappointed with BB. I know he had a ton of success at EWU.

I wonder how much of his offensive success were due to OC’s he hired over the years. Our offense is primarily based on RPO and spread game. Was that the case at EWU? We have a RS freshman at QB and our receivers seem to get little if any separation, which puts some questions on Edwards.

Anyway, I wanted to get some historical takes on BB and EWU during his tenure there. Again, not wanting to point fingers but get more texture on his success there and understand his back story. I’m hopeful he finds success at Cal but if we have another year of this kind of offense (last in the PAC, near worst of P5 schools) Baldwin will likely not be retained.

Thanks!

 

[EWURanger]

Hi Eagles fans-
I’m a Cal fan and wanted to come here to leave more about your former coach Baldwin (and Edwards).

When we first hired him, many felt pretty bullish about him given his record. In the 2 seasons we’ve had him, we haven’t had a very successful offense nor have we seen much growth and progression.

My intent isn’t to lay blame. It’s clear we have a defensive identity which makes sense given Wilcox and his past. It’s pretty clear we’ve been pretty conservative on offense since our talent is on the other side of the ball. We’re also generally lacking star talent on offense.

Still, many Can fans are disappointed with BB. I know he had a ton of success at EWU.

I wonder how much of his offensive success were due to OC’s he hired over the years. Our offense is primarily based on RPO and spread game. Was that the case at EWU? We have a RS freshman at QB and our receivers seem to get little if any separation, which puts some questions on Edwards.

Anyway, I wanted to get some historical takes on BB and EWU during his tenure there. Again, not wanting to point fingers but get more texture on his success there and understand his back story. I’m hopeful he finds success at Cal but if we have another year of this kind of offense (last in the PAC, near worst of P5 schools) Baldwin will likely not be retained.

Thanks!

Quick take. Baldwin’s last year at EWU, we had Troy Taylor (current Utah OC) as our OC. I’d say that prior to that, BB basically doubled as HC/OC during his tenure at EWU. I believe he called all offensive plays even as HC. We generally always had an offense near the top of the FCS during his tenure, although that still seems to be the case even after his departure. Main criticisms of his teams were lack of balance on offense (run/pass) and generally mediocre defenses. This is probably the reason he didn’t win more national championships at EWU.

By and large he’a a great offensive mind. I don’t have a great feel on why his offenses haven’t been better at Cal. He beat Pac-12 teams while he was at EWU based solely on really great offensive performances.

 

[FormerEag]

Hi Eagles fans-
I’m a Cal fan and wanted to come here to leave more about your former coach Baldwin (and Edwards).

When we first hired him, many felt pretty bullish about him given his record. In the 2 seasons we’ve had him, we haven’t had a very successful offense nor have we seen much growth and progression.

My intent isn’t to lay blame. It’s clear we have a defensive identity which makes sense given Wilcox and his past. It’s pretty clear we’ve been pretty conservative on offense since our talent is on the other side of the ball. We’re also generally lacking star talent on offense.

Still, many Can fans are disappointed with BB. I know he had a ton of success at EWU.

I wonder how much of his offensive success were due to OC’s he hired over the years. Our offense is primarily based on RPO and spread game. Was that the case at EWU? We have a RS freshman at QB and our receivers seem to get little if any separation, which puts some questions on Edwards.

Anyway, I wanted to get some historical takes on BB and EWU during his tenure there. Again, not wanting to point fingers but get more texture on his success there and understand his back story. I’m hopeful he finds success at Cal but if we have another year of this kind of offense (last in the PAC, near worst of P5 schools) Baldwin will likely not be retained.

Thanks!

Quick take. Baldwin’s last year at EWU, we had Troy Taylor (current Utah OC) as our OC. I’d say that prior to that, BB basically doubled as HC/OC during his tenure at EWU. I believe he called all offensive plays even as HC. We generally always had an offense near the top of the FCS during his tenure, although that still seems to be the case even after his departure. Main criticisms of his teams were lack of balance on offense (run/pass) and generally mediocre defenses. This is probably the reason he didn’t win more national championships at EWU.

By and large he’a a great offensive mind. I don’t have a great feel on why his offenses haven’t been better at Cal. He beat Pac-12 teams while he was at EWU based solely on really great offensive performances.

He also had better offensive weapons, IMO. The Adams, Kupps, Mitchells, Kaufmans, Edwards of the EWU world are probably better than what he's working with two years into a regime in Berkeley.

 

[TheGreatOski]

I guess the question is whether he can only beat the competition with superior talent. We’re EWU offenses productive when you had similar talent to your opponents?

We have some pretty good talent on our team but the ball isn’t getting to them enough. The RPO game also looks poorly executed — might just be a new, young QB that needs time. Our starting QB got hurt in game 1 and we haven’t seen him since.

 

[luckyintheorder]

I guess the question is whether he can only beat the competition with superior talent. We’re EWU offenses productive when you had similar talent to your opponents?

We have some pretty good talent on our team but the ball isn’t getting to them enough. The RPO game also looks poorly executed — might just be a new, young QB that needs time. Our starting QB got hurt in game 1 and we haven’t seen him since.

:thumbdown:

Sounds like you've made up your mind. Not sure we should give you any credit for common practices like using the internet to look up data from Beau's time here where he molded at least three All American QB's, found talent that no one else offered and created offenses that avg'd 45+ points a game against all levels of competition...

As far as I can recollect, there was never ONE post on this board where someone wanted to see Coach Baldwin leave the program. That is all you really need to know. The rest is pure speculation. Perhaps you should mine your fans for more information about Wilcox's involvement; it's the only new element in Baldwin's football life. Ask Wilcox what's up with BB.

 

[luckyintheorder]

To further speculate... Some HC's with a defensive specialty have been known to limit their offenses so as to not be shown up. Wilcox has bigger fish to fry than Cal. He hired other coaches with a lot of HC experience to shore up his inexperience and is making a typical new HC mistake of not letting them do what they were hired to do. Who can say where Wilcox goes next, but his plan is to go IMO. Sometimes people bite their nose off in spite of their face..

 

[clawman1]

Greatoski;
Are you drunk, high, or just a bad typist?

 

[eaglesfootball]

A while back i remember reading some speculation regarding whether BB had complete control over Cal’s offense. Isn’t there a “co” OC or some other sort of weird arrangement there? Is BB even calling the plays?

 

[eaglesfootball]

I guess the question is whether he can only beat the competition with superior talent. We’re EWU offenses productive when you had similar talent to your opponents?

We have some pretty good talent on our team but the ball isn’t getting to them enough. The RPO game also looks poorly executed — might just be a new, young QB that needs time. Our starting QB got hurt in game 1 and we haven’t seen him since.

:thumbdown:

Sounds like you've made up your mind. Not sure we should give you any credit for common practices like using the internet to look up data from Beau's time here where he molded at least three All American QB's, found talent that no one else offered and created offenses that avg'd 45+ points a game against all levels of competition...

As far as I can recollect, there was never ONE post on this board where someone wanted to see Coach Baldwin leave the program. That is all you really need to know. The rest is pure speculation. Perhaps you should mine your fans for more information about Wilcox's involvement; it's the only new element in Baldwin's football life. Ask Wilcox what's up with BB.

5 All-Americans to be exact. Meyer, Nichols, Mitchell, Adams, and Gubrud.

Let’s also not forget that his offenses produced THREE Walter Payton Award winners.

 

[LDopaPDX]

No reason to jump on the guy; he's asking an honest question.

I've been seriously confused as to why Baldwin's offenses haven't performed better as well. My only guess is that it's due to youth or players not quite buying into the system. Baldwin was 6-5 in his first year and 8-4 the next. Then in year three, Eastern wins a national championship. Maybe that's the turnaround on his system.

 

[HeavyIsTheCrown]

To further speculate... Some HC's with a defensive specialty have been known to limit their offenses so as to not be shown up. Wilcox has bigger fish to fry than Cal. He hired other coaches with a lot of HC experience to shore up his inexperience and is making a typical new HC mistake of not letting them do what they were hired to do. Who can say where Wilcox goes next, but his plan is to go IMO. Sometimes people bite their nose off in spite of their face..

+1

 

[TheGreatOski]

Not sure why people are getting upset and defensive. It was an honest question. I have no sense of EWU and their talent relative to the rest of the conference. Much like USC always pulls the best talent in the conference, it’s not a surprise they’re typically successful (not this year obviously).

I was also hoping to get more texture on whether his offenses heavily relies on great QB’s and what kind of offenses he ran. I watched a 2016 highlight reel of Kupp against WSU and the plays look like what he’s been running here but obviously there was just a physical mismatch with his size.

My guess is that he’s been given mostly free reign to install his system but we have a young QB who needs more experience and an OL that could get bigger and better.

 

[clawman1]

Not sure why people are getting upset and defensive. It was an honest question. I have no sense of EWU and their talent relative to the rest of the conference. Much like USC always pulls the best talent in the conference, it’s not a surprise they’re typically successful (not this year obviously).

I was also hoping to get more texture on whether his offenses heavily relies on great QB’s and what kind of offenses he ran. I watched a 2016 highlight reel of Kupp against WSU and the plays look like what he’s been running here but obviously there was just a physical mismatch with his size.

My guess is that he’s been given mostly free reign to install his system but we have a young QB who needs more experience and an OL that could get bigger and better.

What were your expectations coming into the 2018 season?
Cal is now 7-3 and would be 8-2 with a win over WSU if Mcelwain had not over thrown his receiver, and Cal could end up with a better record than Stanford!
Your comment on Edwards caught my attention, as I would think you know he coached Cooper Kupp and Kendrick Bourne of the 'niners. He is very capable when he gets the right kids.

 

[luckyintheorder]

No reason to jump on the guy; he's asking an honest question.

I've been seriously confused as to why Baldwin's offenses haven't performed better as well. My only guess is that it's due to youth or players not quite buying into the system. Baldwin was 6-5 in his first year and 8-4 the next. Then in year three, Eastern wins a national championship. Maybe that's the turnaround on his system.

Dopa, this is family only chatter. This guy isn't family. OUR speculation has love/respect as an element. Smile man, it'll be OK

 

[Seattle Eagle]

I was also hoping to get more texture on whether his offenses heavily relies on great QB’s and what kind of offenses he ran.

Absolutely. 100%. The Qb has a lot of autonomy in Baldwin’s offense and EWU has aways thrived on really good Qb play. Coach BB is the Qb whisperer. I have also wondered if he is being handcuffed at Cal, or perhaps just needs more time. From what I’ve seen of Cal this year the Qb is very young and inexperienced.

 

[Seattle Eagle]

No reason to jump on the guy; he's asking an honest question.

I've been seriously confused as to why Baldwin's offenses haven't performed better as well. My only guess is that it's due to youth or players not quite buying into the system. Baldwin was 6-5 in his first year and 8-4 the next. Then in year three, Eastern wins a national championship. Maybe that's the turnaround on his system.

Agreed. The guy is asking an honest question and went to the best place to get informed opinions. I can respect that. No reason to be defensive whatsoever.

 

[LDopaPDX]

Not sure why people are getting upset and defensive. It was an honest question. I have no sense of EWU and their talent relative to the rest of the conference. Much like USC always pulls the best talent in the conference, it’s not a surprise they’re typically successful (not this year obviously).

I was also hoping to get more texture on whether his offenses heavily relies on great QB’s and what kind of offenses he ran. I watched a 2016 highlight reel of Kupp against WSU and the plays look like what he’s been running here but obviously there was just a physical mismatch with his size.

My guess is that he’s been given mostly free reign to install his system but we have a young QB who needs more experience and an OL that could get bigger and better.

Talent-wise, Eastern is the USC in your analogy. Even in down years, we have as much talent as just about anyone... At least on offense.

Baldwin's main problem while at Eastern was that he never got the defense to play on the same level. As an OC, he shouldn't be in charge of that now, so it shouldn't matter (in theory).

 

[TheGreatOski]

Not sure why people are getting upset and defensive. It was an honest question. I have no sense of EWU and their talent relative to the rest of the conference. Much like USC always pulls the best talent in the conference, it’s not a surprise they’re typically successful (not this year obviously).

I was also hoping to get more texture on whether his offenses heavily relies on great QB’s and what kind of offenses he ran. I watched a 2016 highlight reel of Kupp against WSU and the plays look like what he’s been running here but obviously there was just a physical mismatch with his size.

My guess is that he’s been given mostly free reign to install his system but we have a young QB who needs more experience and an OL that could get bigger and better.

What were your expectations coming into the 2018 season?
Cal is now 7-3 and would be 8-2 with a win over WSU if Mcelwain had not over thrown his receiver, and Cal could end up with a better record than Stanford!
Your comment on Edwards caught my attention, as I would think you know he coached Cooper Kupp and Kendrick Bourne of the 'niners. He is very capable when he gets the right kids.

The fan vase is definitely content to happy about the win-loss record. But if you look closer you’ll see it’s largely due to the defense which is arguably the 1st in the PAC.

Agreed about the chance for more wins if McIlwain didn’t play but that brings it back to Baldwin as there are questions on whose decision it was to flip flop between him and Garbers, our other QB. That 3 game loss streak where we heavily played McIlwain hoping to take advantage of his mobility but resulting in a record number of turnovers.

My question around Edwards is whether Kupp is his claim to fame or if he was considered a good receivers coach outside of 1 or 2 outliers. Our receiver production has fallen dramatically. Granted before we had NFL qb’s in Goff and Davis Webb under Sonny Dykes air raid.

 

[TheGreatOski]

I was also hoping to get more texture on whether his offenses heavily relies on great QB’s and what kind of offenses he ran.

Absolutely. 100%. The Qb has a lot of autonomy in Baldwin’s offense and EWU has aways thrived on really good Qb play. Coach BB is the Qb whisperer. I have also wondered if he is being handcuffed at Cal, or perhaps just needs more time. From what I’ve seen of Cal this year the Qb is very young and inexperienced.

Thanks!

 

[TheGreatOski]

Not sure why people are getting upset and defensive. It was an honest question. I have no sense of EWU and their talent relative to the rest of the conference. Much like USC always pulls the best talent in the conference, it’s not a surprise they’re typically successful (not this year obviously).

I was also hoping to get more texture on whether his offenses heavily relies on great QB’s and what kind of offenses he ran. I watched a 2016 highlight reel of Kupp against WSU and the plays look like what he’s been running here but obviously there was just a physical mismatch with his size.

My guess is that he’s been given mostly free reign to install his system but we have a young QB who needs more experience and an OL that could get bigger and better.

Talent-wise, Eastern is the USC in your analogy. Even in down years, we have as much talent as just about anyone... At least on offense.

Baldwin's main problem while at Eastern was that he never got the defense to play on the same level. As an OC, he shouldn't be in charge of that now, so it shouldn't matter (in theory).

Thanks!