Time to leave the Big Sky?

[SWeberCat02]

I'm really getting tired of watching terrible after terrible team come play us at the Dee. The Big Sky is presently one of the worst conferences in the nation. I've always liked the Big Sky and never before advocated Weber leaving, but the conference is just so awful now that it's getting painful to watch. Problem is, there is nowhere else to go, and having an average football program makes any potential move almost impossible. Only option would be to create a new conference with the best six teams from the Sky (Weber, UM, and ?) and add Idaho and New Mexico St.

 

[wsucatfan]

I'm really getting tired of watching terrible after terrible team come play us at the Dee. The Big Sky is presently one of the worst conferences in the nation. I've always liked the Big Sky and never before advocated Weber leaving, but the conference is just so awful now that it's getting painful to watch. Problem is, there is nowhere else to go, and having an average football program makes any potential move almost impossible. Only option would be to create a new conference with the best six teams from the Sky (Weber, UM, and ?) and add Idaho and New Mexico St.

100% agree. Time to get rid of some Big Sky dead weight. Pick up Seatle, (maybe pick up Denver). Invite USU when the Mtn West kicks them out...

What teams are value added?

 

[weberwildcat]

its just all this stupid conf realignment nonsense. its changing, its not done, it may never be done. its so much worse for so many schools if not all. the conferences are getting rediculous. we only added suu and und and tried for usd because we were scared of going extinct like what is happening to the wac.

big sky was afraid and is now worse off. is it better to be scared and grow or chance extinction...i dont know.

adding suu and und, year 1, is looking really bad for the sky. big sky was needing improvement as it was and now we add TWO 300 RPI schools. that kills a conf and 11 teams is too many, and then we add a 12 in 2 yrs that is another 250+ rpi team.

as for leaving i am not sure how that would be possible or make sense. big sky is good, makes sense in football though for me its too many teams. in bball i dont like that its now worse. bovee once said, sure we can consider moving upward if we are packing the football stadium. that is true. until that happens nothing will change. and no its not about bad marketing...etc, being a basketball school doesn't matter. look at the big east or whats left of it.

big sky being ranked 17-21 out of 32 was fine but now in 2013 we are talking 27-29... :thumbdown: :wall: :thefan: :bad: :yikes: :shocking:

 

[n.ogdencat]

Folks this isn't going to happen. We are stuck in the Sky. Until our football program can move forward, Weber won't be going anywhere. Lets look at the bright side of things...there is always plenty of room for the Sky to improve in basketball, which I think will happen (hell it wouldn't take much) and the Sky is probably the strongest FCS football conference in the nation. Adding Idaho to basketball should improve the Sky, but it probably won't. No matter, it is where the Cats are and it isn't hurting our program. Weber is only getting better each year and solidifying its spot as one of the top teams in the west.


Adding SUU and UND wasn't exactly bad, just for basketball. Football wise it was a solid move. Both schools showed that they would be excellent additions for the conference. Neither pulled a UNCO and decided to be competitive right away instead of taking a decade to win in football.

 

[wazzuwildcat03]

Leaving the conference would be stupid. I love our conference and the rivalries in it. Yes it sucks balls now in basketball other than us and Montana, but it will get better. I would be pissed if we left. We have not even won the conference tournament since 2007 so we are getting way ahead of ourselves and we should not get all cocky becasue we are good and most of the conference is struggling right now. Add Idaho next year and we have 12 solid schools. I agree will Tal. This should not even be a discussion. Go Big Sky

 

[WILDCAT]

Weber is where they belong

 

[bincitysioux]

I think in time that North Dakota will climb the RPI ladder and settle into the top half of the conference. UND is the biggest school in our state, has a supportive fanbase, excellent facilities, an administration that supports athletics, and a good basketball tradition.

One of the biggest reasons for our struggles the last 5 years has been that we've had to schedule around 20 non-conference games. That made for an erratic and unstructured travel schedule that I really think has plagued this team.

I think Idaho's re-addition to the Big Sky and going to divisional play will make it a stronger conference as well. Certainly fundamentally if not competetively right away.

 

[WILDCAT]

This is the same stupid argument that Montana's football fans are always spouting out, the Big Sky is horrible blah blah blah.


This great Weber team that is "too strong for the Big Sky" hasnt been to the dance since 07, including 2 HUGE choke-jobs on our own court. Until Weber's mens team can win every single Big Sky game for the next 5 years and does it convincingly and thier Womens team can actually WIN A FREAKIN GAME then this argument is pointless.

 

[weberwildcat]

there is no where better we would want to be anyway. i would rather be in the big sky than join the big west or wac. i dont like the new big sky as much as the older big sky but what are we supposed to do? jion the pac 13? and going fbs is not happening or even worth discussing.

 

[sapokama]

The problem I see is that the Big Sky Conference is a football myopic conference. That is understandable since most of its revenue likely comes from football. But Weber is not a football first school which, In that sense, makes it a little bit of a bad fit in this conference.

Unfortunately, unlike to east, there aren't a ton of D1 conferences in the west. The big west has no football and would be a lateral move at best. Weber doesn't fit the university profile for the WCC. The jump is too big for the MWC (in all sports except cross country at this point). Making a new conference with Idaho and New Mexico State would be fun, but Weber isn't ready to be an FBS school, so both Idaho and New Mexico State would have to move down to the FCS. (I would be surprised if the Big Sky would allow Weber to keep its football program in the conference if they took all other sports out of it)

I know it's hard watching these bad teams play the Wildcats every night, but for now, even though its not the greatest fit, it is still the best fit for Weber.

 

[oldrunner]

The BSC leadership needs to put additional presure on all of its members to invest in whatever programs they are deficient in. They keep talking about growing the brand and yet the investment in that brand is lacking. For some schools, it should be put up or get out. It's harsh, but nothing is happening with 'nice talk'. :twocents:

 

[SWWeatherCat]

Leave the Big Sky? :rofl: How about win the Big Sky (basketball) and compete in the Big Sky (football) before any crazy talk. How about figuring out how to get a sizable (non-traditional) student body supporting athletics? For that matter, how about getting the home town community supporting Weber, at least more than USU, the U, and the Y.

I don't enjoy the poor competition at the DEC either, but as for conference play, Weber has plenty of competition when it matters most. Out of conference, I don't think Weber has the money needed to get enough home games consistently, and quality opponents to boot. It's amazing what money and better fan support can do for your program.

Some years ago Weber tried hosting a few tournaments and I don't remember them being attended very well. I was just thinking about tournaments and better quality opponents and thought why not try something that might be more attractive to fans but still keep costs at bay with something like this:
- The years USU plays in Ogden, Weber is invited to the Gossner Classic.
- The years WSU plays in Logan, Weber hosts a tournament and invites USU.
- The other teams in both tournaments should be D1 teams that might interest fans for whatever reason but certainly should be teams that Weber and USU can typically compete with making a fair chance that Weber and USU get another shot to go at each other.

As for football, the FCS is where Weber belongs and, personally, I would hate to see them in the fBS, not that they would ever be able to make that jump-- not enough $$$ and not near enough fan support, they would lose out recruiting vs the big 3 too. In the FCS, does it get much better than the Big Sky, at least in recent years? I've never understood why Weber can't ever seem to build on any football momentum they have-- perennial average teams, with an occasional decent year or two.

Instead of looking at what conference change could be better for Weber, Weber needs to continue making itself a better institution, both academically and athletically. Weber's marketing and ability to excite the community and put butts in seats has improved recently to a "less than acceptable" status. The good news: that's up from "absolutely dismal." Ann Milner was a great President, I hope the new guy continues the progress she has made in all faucets of the University, including her avid support of the athletics programs. Weber is capable of so much more and seemingly could make much better use of potential resources in the form of the school programs and those earning degrees in those programs (i.e. Business, Marketing, Communications, etc.) Put those kids and practical theory to work in the real world and at the same same improve the University.

 

[wsucatfan]

there is no where better we would want to be anyway. i would rather be in the big sky than join the big west or wac. i dont like the new big sky as much as the older big sky but what are we supposed to do? join the pac 13? and going fbs is not happening or even worth discussing.

No one is suggesting a jump to FBS, I have posted similar shuffling ideas here and there.

What should happen (IMO) is WSU and UM band together and cherry pick the best football/basketball schools from the oversized big sky and put together a new FCS conference and leave the rest in the Big Sky.
Idaho (with a long term conference commitment), UM, MSU, WSU, EWU, Poly and/or Davis for the Cali footprint, Seattle U, (and maybe pick up UND, NMSU, and/or Denver). Leaves the Big Sky with ISU, SUU, UNC, PSU, Sac St, NAU, and any others left off from the new conference.

This would also position the new conference to be the best FCS conference in the West with a secondary FCS western conference to schedule non-conference games with as needed. Lastly the long term option to move to the new tier 2 FBS level if the BCS schools move up and out, if and when it is fixed and a true playoff division.

Sure we wish that we had 15000 in the seats for football and 12000 for basketball, but it's the chicken and the egg. Get a winning product on the field with/against teams that the public cares about or even knows about and you will increase your fan support. If you are not trying to improve then you are moving backward because everyone else is trying to improve their school by making their conference better or moving to a new conference. U of U, BYU (debateable), USU, and SUU have all improved their school standings, while we have stayed pat. We can't be content with being SUU/UVU's equal, or pretty soon we will be dealing with Dixie U (whatever their new name is going to be) also. We need to try and catch up with USU, aka beating them more than once every 6-10 years, same with BYU. Winning against our state schools is crutial to everything, instate opinion (including media), recruiting, fan base, etc.

Speaking of which, the Des News put out an article on "Utah high school basketball: 10 boys basketball players to watch moving into region play" http://www.deseretnews.com/article/...players-to-watch-moving-into-region-play.html
Out of these 10 kids, Four are future Cougars, one future Ute two future Aggies, and one future Thunderbird. I am sure WSU was/is interested in these kids but we have zero of the top local kids signed or verbaled (including Weber High player Hayden Schenck, 28.4 ppg).

I just want the best for WSU.

 

[AlumniWSU]

Reality check...Yes, there's not a one of us WSU fans who don't wish for bigger/better for the Wildcats, but don't get all giddy about Wildcat basketball superiority in the Big Sky. The BSC is a fine fit for Weber State, in both fb & bb; there's always going to be weak teams (and their intent is to improve). Divisional play will solve the "too big for scheduling" issue. BB fact is, outside the BSC and especially INSTATE vs. the "Big 3", Coach Rahe's record isn't exactly stellar (ex: 0-7 against BYU). How about the BSC & national tourney play?? Last 3 years - embarrasing endings. As for FB, BSC is great for FCS in west...glad WSU belongs, but needs strong effort & some good luck to pull itself from bottom half. Attendance/Recruiting? LOL in getting quality teams to the Dee/Stewart or luring instate blue chipper players for Weber when the Y, U, Aggies come calling. So far, Coach Rahe appears to know the "bottom-feeder" role instate or at least acts like it (to my disappointment). For Weber State, it's where it belongs competitively and the Big Sky, while not perfect, is the place to be. Not saying there is always good cause & good intent for improvement as is. Realignment continues crazy (and detrimental sometimes)...see where there's some fall back (ex: Boise St. mind change about Big East). :twocents:

 

[WILDCAT]

People are talking about getting the best of the Big Sky in football and basketball and separating, but in what world is Weber one of the better football schools? Weber's football program is horrible.

 

[wsucatfan]

People are talking about getting the best of the Big Sky in football and basketball and separating, but in what world is Weber one of the better football schools? Weber's football program is horrible.

No one is suggesting WSU has a top FCS caliber football program, last year was a huge letdown based on the previous 3-4 years, so it is a good thing our basketball program is a contender for the Big Sky every year.

 

[AlumniWSU]

Best hope is for even number of BB teams balance in BSC for a divisional split (with Idaho you get 12). So better hope Vandals don't change their minds in rejoining. Still going to have weak teams in, but that mix changes some over time. Would rather see Wildcat basketball as a big fish in a small pond...& that pond offers some incentives, like close rivalries and a NCAA automatic tourney bid. Think of the logistics (& $$) to form a new conference. Not easy to do or you would see more around; today's trend is to BIG size. As to schools realigning, what's the driver currently?...It's FOOTBALL (and $$$ with it)...Weber State has little to offer there! :shock: The challenges for the Wildcats await in the BIG SKY!

 

[WILDCAT]

I will say one thing though, destroying our conf mates in basketball isnt doing us any favors, we fell like 70 spots in the RPI after crushing both UNC and UND

 

[Skippy]

its just all this stupid conf realignment nonsense. its changing, its not done, it may never be done. its so much worse for so many schools if not all. the conferences are getting rediculous. we only added suu and und and tried for usd because we were scared of going extinct like what is happening to the wac.

big sky was afraid and is now worse off. is it better to be scared and grow or chance extinction...i dont know.

adding suu and und, year 1, is looking really bad for the sky. big sky was needing improvement as it was and now we add TWO 300 RPI schools. that kills a conf and 11 teams is too many, and then we add a 12 in 2 yrs that is another 250+ rpi team.

as for leaving i am not sure how that would be possible or make sense. big sky is good, makes sense in football though for me its too many teams. in bball i dont like that its now worse. bovee once said, sure we can consider moving upward if we are packing the football stadium. that is true. until that happens nothing will change. and no its not about bad marketing...etc, being a basketball school doesn't matter. look at the big east or whats left of it.

big sky being ranked 17-21 out of 32 was fine but now in 2013 we are talking 27-29... :thumbdown: :wall: :thefan: :bad: :yikes: :shocking:

The addition of Southern Utah is actually looking pretty good right now. The T-Birds are 3-0 in conference play and will likely be 4-1 after this week's games are over.

 

[Webergrad02]

I will say one thing though, destroying our conf mates in basketball isnt doing us any favors, we fell like 70 spots in the RPI after crushing both UNC and UND

It is still too early to give the RPI a lot of merit. The increase in conference games this year will hurt our RPI. The conference is down no doubt about it. But I don't think switching conferences is the answer. Before we trash our current league too much, it would be nice to win the regular season and post season titles.