WAC is Getting Desperate

[oldrunner]

The WAC is trying hard not to fall apart.

https://www.thespectrum.com/story/sports/college/dixie-state/2018/10/30/dsu-closing-division-move/1822468002/

 

[SWeberCat02]

They just upgraded their football stadium, with more improvements to come. It's better than what UNC and SUU have. UNC's is a HS stadium that doesn't even have lights. DSU is an expanding school in one of the fastest growing areas of the country. I'd trade them for UNC, and maybe even SUU.

 

[oldrunner]

They just upgraded their football stadium, with more improvements to come. It's better than what UNC and SUU have. UNC's is a HS stadium that doesn't even have lights. DSU is an expanding school in one of the fastest growing areas of the country. I'd trade them for UNC, and maybe even SUU.

As it is now, the BSC does not need more teams. DSU is a few years away from getting where they need to be. The only way I could see the BSC bringing in more schools is if it was an expand and split sort of scenario. In that model I could see the BSC expanding to 20 teams and then splitting into two 10 school coferences.

If one of the two were to be a mix of BB and FB, then the FB playing schools could interplay with the regular BSC schools to fill out a FCS eligible schedule. That could work. If a partnership were maintained, scheduling could get easier for BB and FB. :nod:

 

[WILDCAT]

This could also be the thing that kick starts football at UVU.

 

[Siouxfan2]

Metro State of Denver has the WAC’s interest too, but Metro doesn’t have fb.
https://roadrunnersathletics.com/news/2018/10/25/general-msu-denver-athletics-to-conduct-ncaa-division-i-feasibility-study.aspx

The WAC was interested in Tarleton St too and they have fb.

CWU has interest from an FCS conference too, as that was tweeted out this spring.

Still maintain that Weber, Idaho and the Montanas are headed for the Summit FBS League.

UCDavis, Cal Poly, Sac St, Sam Houston St, Lamar, another Southland school are going FBS with the WAC. UTRGV starts Fb and plays FBS by 2025, when they would be eligible for a CFP payment when that is renegotiated. FBS teams will get over a million $ and maybe two but they need facilities first and a fan base.

UVU and Seattle will also become part of the depleted Big Sky which will likely be:

CWU-EWU
Port St-Seattle ( non fb)
Idaho St - UVU (non fb for now)
No Colo - Metro St ( non fb)
Dixie St - SUU
NAU - Azusa Pacific

Good travel partners for the new cheapo conference in the West (except the last pairing)

The Summit FBS becomes

Idaho - Montana
Mont St - Weber St
Denver - Omaha ( no fb for both)
UND - NDSU
USD - SDSU

Maybe Seattle can fit in for mbb.

PUFW, WIU and ORU leave.

The new FBS WAC

Pacific Div
UCDavis-SAC St
Cal Poly- Cal Baptist (no fb)
NMSU - GCU ( no fb)

Southwest Divison
Sam Houston St - Lamar
UTRGV - Another Southland school (Incarnate Word has said they were considering FBS)
UMKC - ORU (no fb for both)
Wichita St - Mo St ( both as affiliate fb members)

 

[oldrunner]

Wow. Do you ever sleep? :lol: :lol:

 

[WSUWildcat]

Still maintain that Weber, Idaho and the Montanas are headed for the Summit FBS League.
The Summit FBS becomes

Idaho - Montana
Mont St - Weber St
Denver - Omaha ( no fb for both)
UND - NDSU
USD - SDSU

IMO, Weber State has zero aspirations for moving up to FBS. Financially, it isn't viable for them to do so while averaging less than 10k fans. As a fan, I would much rather cheer for an FCS playoff contender than a middle of the road team from a bottom tier conference.

 

[WSUfan1]

Still maintain that Weber, Idaho and the Montanas are headed for the Summit FBS League.
The Summit FBS becomes

Idaho - Montana
Mont St - Weber St
Denver - Omaha ( no fb for both)
UND - NDSU
USD - SDSU

IMO, Weber State has zero aspirations for moving up to FBS. Financially, it isn't viable for them to do so while averaging less than 10k fans. As a fan, I would much rather cheer for an FCS playoff contender than a middle of the road team from a bottom tier conference.

I wouldnt say "zero." I believe that there are plans somewhere to get FB on a more national level. As Bovee said yesterday on 1280 the Zone, "we have a number 4 ranked team in the country, and all you see from the media is how bad things are going for BYU, and hardly anything about the success we are having here."

If WSU were FBS, youd have an average of 18k fans a game. If you had BYU, USU, or even U of U on the schedule, that game alone is a sellout, with the need for additional seating. Then throw in one or two non-conf games vs a MW or other type school, and things start looking good fan wise. I think it is only a matter of time till FB is FBS, personally. Behind closed doors, you know athletics is talking about it.

 

[SWeberCat02]

This fan doesn't want FBS. If I did I'd be a Utah, USU, or BYU fan. I love FCS. It's true college football with a real playoff system. FBS is made up of a semi-pro P5 controlled by television, and a bunch of other schools that don't matter and won't ever have a real chance at a national championship. And I don't much care what the local media thinks. I stopped listening to that noise long ago.

 

[wsucatfan]

The G5 conferences is the new 1-AA/FCS, it's only a matter of time until the P5 split off and do their own thing. WSU needs to be ready to move to the 2nd tier that includes a FCS like playoff. Regardless of if that's a Summit conference, revised WAC, new conference , we need to keep winning where we are at now with an eye to future growth.

 

[WSUWildcat]

I wouldnt say "zero." I believe that there are plans somewhere to get FB on a more national level. As Bovee said yesterday on 1280 the Zone, "we have a number 4 ranked team in the country, and all you see from the media is how bad things are going for BYU, and hardly anything about the success we are having here."

Maybe if Weber was better at marketing it would be different. But BYU and Utah are always going to dominate the local scene, no matter what Weber does. Ask USU how third string feels, they are also ranked and out of the press.

If WSU were FBS, youd have an average of 18k fans a game. If you had BYU, USU, or even U of U on the schedule, that game alone is a sellout, with the need for additional seating. Then throw in one or two non-conf games vs a MW or other type school, and things start looking good fan wise. I think it is only a matter of time till FB is FBS, personally. Behind closed doors, you know athletics is talking about it.

Maybe USU would visit on a two for one. BYU and Utah will never do a home and home or even a two for one. Merely going FBS does not equate to double the average attendance. Especially if we are not relevant locally or even within a conference.

 

[SWWeatherCat]

This fan doesn't want FBS. If I did I'd be a Utah, USU, or BYU fan. I love FCS. It's true college football with a real playoff system. FBS is made up of a semi-pro P5 controlled by television, and a bunch of other schools that don't matter and won't ever have a real chance at a national championship. And I don't much care what the local media thinks. I stopped listening to that noise long ago.

You couldn't have stated my opinion any better :thumb:

It's a great time to be a FCS/Weber fan too :nod:

 

[oldrunner]

IMHO, if the P5 do create a bigger split with the G5, there will be a push to consolidate the G5 with the FCS. It makes a lot of sense and there has been talk of that happening. The financial burden on the majority of G5 schools is just too great. Of course there would have to be all sorts of agreements made on things like the number of grants, number of coaches, and that sort of thing. However, it is quite workable. The NCAA could have another robust playoff system and the P5s could spend all their time as a semipro league. That is what they want anyway. The NCAA could wash their hands of them and all of their dirty tricks. The NCAA would no longer have to look the other way on all of the payoffs, bribes, and academic fraud. The NCAA is not equipped to go against the financial behemoths in the P5.

 

[PurpleBlood]

No question BYU and USU would both visit. Plus we would be able to sell tickets for more money and we would get 500k more for money games. With the endzone plaza and the temporary seating that could be added to the south endzone, we could have a nice stadium with capacity around 22k or so. Competing at the FBS level is no harder if your conference mates are the same teams you played against in FCS. Or we can just sit around while UVU and Dixie compete at our level. It’s time for Ogden to put on some big boy pants or be left behind.

 

[WSUfan1]

No question BYU and USU would both visit. Plus we would be able to sell tickets for more money and we would get 500k more for money games. With the endzone plaza and the temporary seating that could be added to the south endzone, we could a nice stadium with capacity around 22k or so. Competing at the FBS level is no harder if your conference mates are the same teams you were FCS with. Or we can just sit around while UVU and Dixie compete at our level. It’s time for Ogden to put on some big boy pants or be left behind.

This.

I have beat this to death in the basketball threads. The BSC is trash when it comes to Bball. Its great or FB at the time, but in the future, its going to look crappy. The thought of SUU joining the BSC made me puke, and then it happened. We have no reason to be in the same talks with UVU and DSU football. That makes me want to die.

 

[Siouxfan2]

Know it’s not my place to interject, but have seen Weber St fans often lament how weak BSC mbb is now. It’s degraded over the years because the schools have changed. The top of the Big Sky would move over and have more formidable teams and fan bases. Montana and Weber St were the only fan bases that impressed me. Idaho and Montana St can get good if they have more incentive (lived in Idaho for a time and Idaho was highly rated close to that time). The South Dakota schools are actually basketball first schools that have rabid fan bases and new or renovated facilities). UND is now hockey first but fb and Mbb have had their moments and have winning records against all the Dakotas. NDSU has historically only been good in fb naturally and in wbb (which has totally disintegrated) and they have a first round mbb victory against Oklahoma, but that was only because the players picked a D1 school when otherwise they would have gone to UND, USD, Minn St-Mankato, or St Cloud St ( almost all of their recruits were Minnesotan).

Think a conference step up would be good for Weber St mbb, certainly with the present Big Sky. Like a half step up to the MWC with lower costs.

Think the Montanas are itching for this to happen academically and athletically (knew an athletic director when I was a kid, and he said the Montanas were trying to get at least UND and NDSU into the Big Sky, but other schools would not allow it) and Idaho and Weber will follow.

 

[n.ogdencat]

I have a theory. Totally my opinion, but I really feel that future conference alignment/changes, and the survival of the WAC depends on BYU. If BYU leaves the WCC, most likely for the MW (it is crazy that they aren't there now and yes the MW would be happy to bring a cash cow like BYU back into the fold), I'm guessing that Gonzaga will follow. That would open two spots in the WCC. Seattle is a former member and Grand Canyon would be, yes an odd addition, but one that somewhat follows the paradigm established for WCC schools (religious/Jesuit schools).

Next, NMSU has an open invite to join the Big Sky, but I think they will end up surviving and eventually getting an invite into the Sun Belt or CUSA, but if not, NMSU would rather go into the Sky than a WAC with DII schools. UVU and UMKC could get into the Summit for Olympic Sports. Who knows if the FBS Summit ever happens, but if it does and UM, MSU, UI go, I'm hoping we go too. Finally, that whatever Texas school, since they are adding football, is a shoe in for Southland. That is why they are adding football. They want out of the WAC and they just got in. Bakersfield will go Big West and should and Cal Baptist...well who cares...they never should have left DII. Finally Cleveland St. is left with its butt flapping in the wind, but DI independence would be far more attractive than a WAC with a bunch of DII's in it.

So, if BYU leaves the WCC...my guess is that the WAC finally dies.

 

[Skippy]

Lots of bagging on the Big Sky in basketball, but the league made a significant move up last year -- 17th overall. I think most fans would be happy with that level of competition if the conference can solidify its position there.

 

[Siouxfan2]

I have a theory. Totally my opinion, but I really feel that future conference alignment/changes, and the survival of the WAC depends on BYU. If BYU leaves the WCC, most likely for the MW (it is crazy that they aren't there now and yes the MW would be happy to bring a cash cow like BYU back into the fold), I'm guessing that Gonzaga will follow. That would open two spots in the WCC. Seattle is a former member and Grand Canyon would be, yes an odd addition, but one that somewhat follows the paradigm established for WCC schools (religious/Jesuit schools).

Next, NMSU has an open invite to join the Big Sky, but I think they will end up surviving and eventually getting an invite into the Sun Belt or CUSA, but if not, NMSU would rather go into the Sky than a WAC with DII schools. UVU and UMKC could get into the Summit for Olympic Sports. Who knows if the FBS Summit ever happens, but if it does and UM, MSU, UI go, I'm hoping we go too. Finally, that whatever Texas school, since they are adding football, is a shoe in for Southland. That is why they are adding football. They want out of the WAC and they just got in. Bakersfield will go Big West and should and Cal Baptist...well who cares...they never should have left DII. Finally Cleveland St. is left with its butt flapping in the wind, but DI independence would be far more attractive than a WAC with a bunch of DII's in it.

So, if BYU leaves the WCC...my guess is that the WAC finally dies.

That’s a fine theory, and parts of it could well have merit, but Dixie St, Metro St and CWU won’t be DI for at least five years and the WAC would lose its autobid by then and the very reason for DI. The WAC should have added four years ago or been adding every year since Idaho left, but haven’t been. It just plain WAC President incompetence or the WAC Presidents know a big move is coming down the pike.

The WAC is just kidding itself to add six teams for FCS which wouldn’t even qualify for the FCS playoffs for seven years (five for the transition and at least two to get an autobid). FCS doesn’t have a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow but FBS now does. Follow that rainbow and the answer will be given, so it’s not FCS but a favor for the already bloated Big Sky to replenish its teams.

Why did the Big West take in Bakersfield and UCSD to swell their total to 11? That’s reduced payments and a ridiculous number for that whole conference unless they know UCDavis and Cal Poly are leaving. It diminished Bakersfield for years saying academically there were not worthy, and suddenly did an about face. They rejected USCD too as they didn’t want a DII school but suddenly they were welcomed. Why did the Big Sky grow so obese? Because it knew that it would effectively split before the new CFP payouts are negotiated. The Presidents know much more information than we posters know and actually have strategic plans and emergence plans. Followed the FBS drama with a SunBelt school that didn’t have fb but now is FBS because had an “inside” information from a source close to the AD, and there was a lot of drama that most posters aren’t aware.

The WAC can still make invites for FBS and that makes its shell so much more valuable than the Big Sky for those wanting FBS. The WAC will survive longer than the Big Sky as key Presidents will make it happen.

GCU is closer to the WCC model than BYU. Pepperdine broke the paradigm because it’s not Jesuit or Catholic. Private schools are known to like FBS conferences, which would be a factor for Gonzaga moving to the MWC, as FBS will be protected in the NCAA with the highest status much longer than the WCC.

 

[Siouxfan2]

A story about McNeese St going FBS. McNeese only has an enrollment of around 8000, but if Lamar can go FBS and has pounded on the Sun Belt door, McNeese will be screwed. Lake Charles is doing pretty well with its expanding nat gas and chemical manufacturing, so it’s not inconceivable. Moreover, this story might be just a plant to get the public’s reaction.
https://www.americanpress.com/opinion/david-berry/moving-up-worth-thinking-about/article_b470a054-e8f9-11e8-8cfd-63cbbb4fdbe9.html

Have long thought Sam Houston St and Lamar would join an FBS WAC along with UCDavis, Sac St and Cal Poly. It would need one more Southland school even if UTRGV starts fb so McNeese would fit the bill.
Weber St, Idaho and the Montanas to a future FBS Summit and Dixie St, CWU and Metro St can backfill the Big Sky.