Western College... Hockey. It's Happening

[Pounder]

After having polluted (for good reason at the start) one of the pro threads with college hockey talk, the reason to bring up the subject in greater detail HAS been announced.

http://www.thesundevils.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&DB_OEM_ID=30300&ATCLID=209771702" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

So I've lingered at hfboards.com a lot the last couple years, seeing what transpires with the effort towards NHL in Seattle (and maybe even Portland) among other places. The business board really took to this to talk about how this could open up the west coast to college hockey. I (among others) did offer the cautionary tale about trying to go up against the WHL in the Northwest. Thing is, if there's any traction beyond Arizona, this does cause more problems for the US WHL teams.

So when I spurred myself to come up with who might join Arizona State, I came up with this (posted at hfboards first)...

Arizona- they HAD a habit of getting fans in the Tucson Convention Center for the club team not that long ago. Having ASU act might move the meter of getting UA to act. Women's lacrosse can happen there, too.

Stanford- they are oozing money there, the space for an arena is there, and if they follow form on The Farm, they'll take the men's team for granted and try to own women's hockey.

(This is where I'd say Cal would follow suit, but they don't have the space for an arena, and it definitely ain't happening in the gym. Not likely.)

Brigham Young- The club team plays at Peaks Ice Arena, it's kind of big anyway. Add bleachers (as was done for the 2002 Olympics) on the other side of the rink and away we go.

Utah Valley- At the other end of University Parkway from BYU, when it was Utah Valley State, they built the arena that they THOUGHT would be the second hockey arena for the Olympics. It can accommodate hockey. It's a Division I school. As there's no football team at Utah Valley, it's at least a possibility.

Weber State- This is more questionable. Olympic curling in 2002 happened at an on-campus arena. It's smaller. They have football. Questionable possibility.

Maybe Washington tries to take up where the Thunderbirds left off at Key Arena. Maybe Oregon would throw some money at Rink Exchange (formerly Lane County Ice) to improve the building OR the main events center building next door within the county fairgrounds... both are big enough to make more of an arena than is presently available (the new campus arena doesn't have the floor dimensions). If the WHL lost its US teams and Portland State dropped football, PSU hockey at Memorial Coliseum is not far-fetched (and neither are the other parts of that equation). You tell me about Colorado. The old San Diego Sports Arena errrrr Valley View Casino Center didn't lose ice-making capability and San Diego State could make a run at this. Even more far-fetched than these is Oregon State, having considered major renovations of Gill Coliseum for a little while now, perhaps branching out to consider razing and rebuilding and including hockey.

I could even go as far as Eastern Washington, who completed a Rec Center including a rink with 850 stadium-quality seats. Probably not enough seats, and I don't know how expandable the facility is, but it certainly catches my attention for them to go that far.

 

[martymoose]

The old San Diego Sports Arena errrrr Valley View Casino Center didn't lose ice-making capability and San Diego State could make a run at this.

I wonder if SDSU could have their on campus arena (Viejas Arena) configured for hockey. Not sure how feasible it is to retrofit ice making capabilities.

 

[Pounder]

http://www.uscho.com/2018/01/26/thursday-vote-regents-approve-construction-new-5000-seat-home-rink-arizona-state/

So nearly 3.5 years later, Arizona State gets around to a plan to build a "real" hockey arena on campus. Apparently the full Board of Regents vote is Thursday. They'd been playing most games in a 700-seat facility on the other side of the "lake" from campus. Building the arena means they're a step closer to joining a hockey conference (most think NCHC, a few think Big 10).

That wait included a year where ASU's facility reps played footsy with the Arizona Coyotes who were considering "building" an arena (aka not really paying for it themselves) right around where that current rink is. The arena would have been a two-building arena, as they proposed a 4,000-seater for ASU hockey. Thing is, the Coyotes predictably wanted most of the revenues and ASU eventually wised up and balked.

That delay cooled talk of other western schools making their own plans. Provided there are any, really. After the initial dreamers subsided with their dreaming, college hockey commissioners kind of started honing in on Stanford and Oregon joining ASU. If there are preparations from either school, they're VERY hush-hush. BTW... points of order. There's not a whole lot of space at the Mac Court site for a hockey arena. I'd be surprised if they pulled that off.

Also, to finally get around to the Martymoose question, no hockey at Viejas for San Diego State. Not enough floor space and not enough dates to make renovation feasible.

In practical terms, there's a reason ASU is going with a new smaller hockey arena and renovating the current basketball arena. Very few schools have an arena playing both basketball teams AND hockey. Maybe none.

That leads me to another tangent. While waiting and seeing nobody else out west commit to college hockey, and while Air Force had somewhat predictably added men's lacrosse to their athletic department (the other services have it, and Denver's national championship means a little something)... UTAH is getting men's lacrosse. So now a Pac-12 school with men's lacrosse, and everyone else in the conference has a potential suitable facility already. Pac-12 Women's Lacrosse is having its inaugural season this year (non-conference schedules start this weekend; 6 schools involved including Oregon). So maybe I've been looking at the wrong sport... and judging from the amount of time you see lacrosse practice or games at Lincoln HS, maybe it's a direction Portland State should be looking at.

 

[bigskyconf]

So contrary to the title, hockey is not happening now? But lacrosse is? And this is why we should drop football?

Too funny.

 

[Pounder]

Let's get something straight... even if football isn't dropped, my gut says Portland State needs to find a different niche just to connect to Portland. Football isn't filling it. We could argue whether basketball started out so well this year that more people should have been flocking to Pamplin despite the location (guaranteed to be my absolute worst argument if I ran with it). I'm seeing a lot of "doing the same things we've always done expecting a different result" nonsense.

 

[Alan1]

Let's get something straight... even if football isn't dropped, my gut says Portland State needs to find a different niche just to connect to Portland. Football isn't filling it. We could argue whether basketball started out so well this year that more people should have been flocking to Pamplin despite the location (guaranteed to be my absolute worst argument if I ran with it). I'm seeing a lot of "doing the same things we've always done expecting a different result" nonsense.

I think football could connect to Portland. I just don't think it is probable. Three straight seasons of making it to the FCS playoffs and an appearance in a championship game just might make that connection. With a record like that we might even get to the point where we were pushing attendance north of 13 or 14K. But that would take an athletic administration and a coaching staff that we don't have and are most unlikely to attract.

 

[Pounder]

I think football could connect to Portland. I just don't think it is probable. Three straight seasons of making it to the FCS playoffs and an appearance in a championship game just might make that connection. With a record like that we might even get to the point where we were pushing attendance north of 13 or 14K. But that would take an athletic administration and a coaching staff that we don't have and are most unlikely to attract.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/college-football-heads-in-wrong-direction-with-largest-attendance-drop-in-34-years/

We are now in a society where famous people aren't even making news anymore when they say "I'm not letting my sons play football." Students everywhere are increasingly not connecting to it, and the impression I've gathered is those in Portland who do connect to it are probably following goings-on in Eugene... and are older than the target population.

I'm hard-pressed to find where the potential for growth lies, short of moving the campus to the deep south. What another poster here thinks is UO and OSU trying to squeeze out Portland State should more likely be considered all P5 conference schools trying to cannibalize lower levels because those dollars are getting harder to chase.

 

[bigskyconf]

I think football could connect to Portland. I just don't think it is probable. Three straight seasons of making it to the FCS playoffs and an appearance in a championship game just might make that connection. With a record like that we might even get to the point where we were pushing attendance north of 13 or 14K. But that would take an athletic administration and a coaching staff that we don't have and are most unlikely to attract.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/college-football-heads-in-wrong-direction-with-largest-attendance-drop-in-34-years/

We are now in a society where famous people aren't even making news anymore when they say "I'm not letting my sons play football." Students everywhere are increasingly not connecting to it, and the impression I've gathered is those in Portland who do connect to it are probably following goings-on in Eugene... and are older than the target population.

I'm hard-pressed to find where the potential for growth lies, short of moving the campus to the deep south. What another poster here thinks is UO and OSU trying to squeeze out Portland State should more likely be considered all P5 conference schools trying to cannibalize lower levels because those dollars are getting harder to chase.

That is an excellent read, did you read it? Just wondering, because I don't see where your could come up with these generalizations, and ultimately, that PSU should drop football from the article. Where does it say famous people are keeping their kids out of football? Where does it say that students are not "connecting" to it? And, where does it say Portland is following Eugene?

Just like a Timbers fan, take something and spin your own thoughts, accept it as fact, and conclude that PSU drop football. As a Vik fan, I will not stand for it and will call you on it every time.

 

[Alan1]

Well, I read it the article referenced and it seems to me the @pounder did too. Where above did he say PSU should drop football.

While this article doesn't say "famous people are keeping their kids out of football." I've seen plenty that do. And actually it does say "...students are not "connecting" to it?" Quoting the article: "...Bill Lutzen, a veteran sports TV programmer: 'This issue is with lack of involvement of the college students. They no longer view attending sporting events as part of the university experience.'" Also: "Student attendance had decreased 7 percent since 2009, Wall Street Journal found in 2014."

With 3 wins out of our last 23 games, no radio and television income, and attendance hovering around 4,500 announced, I'd be willing to venture that Viking football is in trouble. Something dramatic needs to happen or I think it will be following the example of PSU wrestling and baseball!

 

[Pounder]

As you can see above, for several years rumors have been spread about UO getting ice hockey. Those rumors have been offered by conference commissioners and, generally, people outside Oregon.

Yesterday was the first time I heard a rumor from closer to the source and in Oregon. It makes some sense... the Hayward Field rebuild is due to be done in time for the Pac-12 T&F championships in May, and hockey could be the next project. Unfortunately, there’s no hints of HOW this would happen.

Part of the rumor is that “a Western school” is trying to arrange it. I think that population is Arizona State (at least the population that has Oregon’s ear). Thing is, since Alaska and Alaska-Anchorage are soon to be without a conference, this western conference would need only two more schools (for now, considering the Alaskas are only assured full programs through the 20-21 season). There have been rumors about UNLV, and a handful of other Pac-12 schools have been discussed.