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What we really need

boisebengal

Active member
Mike Kramer has alluded to the fact that ISU has just had a handful of winning seasons over the last 40 years or so, and this losing tradition is the kind of thing that wears on the Bengal fan over the years, and you wonder if there's any glimpse of light at the end of the tunnel. Now hiring a guy like Kramer is a good start in turning this program around, as he's definitely one of the better guys we could have gotten considering the circumstances. But right now when you look at the talent we have on hand, coupled with the injury situation and the APR problems, even guys like Bear Bryant or Vince Lombardi would have a difficult time winning games here with what we have to work with.

We really need to spend another $20 million or so and get the dome renovated, and if this were to happen, then this would be a very nice recruiting tool and we could get some very good talent here that we wouldn't be able to get otherwise. And getting a nice new million dollar turf is a nice start, and very much appreciated by the players, as well as the new scoreboard, but we've got a ways to get to where we need to be. And I don't know where we stand as far as fundraising is concerned for the things we need, or if any money has been raised at all -- although I know that Jeff Tingey, Donna and Jay have been working very hard to achieve this goal. I think that renovating the dome is our first priority, and the next priority would be to build a nice $20 million gym next to the dome. And after that we would need a nice $10 million dollar indoor practice facility for football.

Just a few years ago it was the taxpayers of Pocatello who soundly defeated a $20 million bond which would have provided badly needed renovations for the dome -- although I know it's difficult to get any kind of bond passed in Pocatello. And ISU could very well go to the students for a vote on this kind of bond, but when you consider that in-state tuition is already over $2500 per semester, and out of state students pay over $6000 per semester, then I think that this proposal could be difficult to pass as well. But in any event something's got to be done soon just to bring the roof, plumbing, lighting, heating, A/C etc. up to code, or else the dome could be condemned.

I can remember back in the 70's and 80's when Kansas State had terrible teams in the back-then Big 8, and they were able to turn their program around after spending millions to renovate their stadium and after they hired a guy by the name of Bill Snyder. And the same thing happened to Oregon State back in the 70's and 80's. They had terrible teams for some time before Reser's spent millions to renovate their stadium about 20 years ago, and they were able to hire some decent coaches. And at ISU some badly needed renovations are the thing that could help Kramer turn this thing around, and we can try to get some kind of winning tradition here. But you wonder where we're going to get the money from.
 
From watching the other teams in the BSC we need better recruits. I am not saying that all the recruits in the past have been all that bad. I feel we have had alot of Div. II talent at best (maybe not even that? getting beat by a Div.II team).

How do we get better talent with out situation? Upgrades, APR issues, past record, non winning traditions to name a few.

The answer is simple: Coach K is the key. He needs to put his best recruiting hat on and go sell them on ISU. WE need size speed and athleticism.
 
We've been through this... $20 million gets you close to a new stadium... it also gets you the slightly improved Holt Arena.
 
The reason I mention the plan about the renovations, is because that's the ISU administration's only plan right now, which leaves the concept of a new stadium out of the question.
 
How did Eastern Washington win a National Championship? Not with fans or facilities. Kramer is the right guy, because he can bring in the right recruits for his team. A dome upgrade will be just somewhat helpful. We need to find a way to have some winning season and then we can get support. I think the support we have given the product is fairly good.

I hate to sound like a cheerleader, but let's get behind Kramer. He needs to keep his confidence and passion.
 
Its really a chicken or the egg question. Will Kramer get it done with or without a stadium? Usually teams have a little success first then the upgrade happens. If your Kramer and you upgrade without success then you have a problem. I would like the see improvement of the dome first. If you do nothing and then you have success what do you have? You have a coach who is a proven winner in Pocatello, ID with a old arena. If your him then after the success you bolt. If you commit to coaches, the players, and most importantly to the city of Pocatello that you are truely committed to turning this thing around it will build for the future. Then maybe Kramer stays after the success to build something some years to come.

Look at Boise, every year its an add on. They were not happy being the best in the WAC, they keep going until they are one of the best in the country. Its a risk to build it yes, but it really can't hurt anything. Also consider that they could start having concerts again which would bring more students and money to local business.
 
This is all a really nice discussion...the chicken or the egg. But that's not the real story. The real story is that right now, without some MAJOR, BIG-LEAGUE donors none of it happens. Where is the money? The school does NOT have it. The state won't fund it. A bond measure won't pass, and as a university employee who works directly with students every day, I feel fairly confident in saying they will not vote to pay more for upgrades.

IF the big-time money is found and donated...that's all good and well. But until then, Coach K is going to have to win with what he's got...with the exception of some small improvements made every year. In other words..."if you build it (a winning program), they (major donors) will come."

IMHO...
 
votb said:
This is all a really nice discussion...the chicken or the egg. But that's not the real story. The real story is that right now, without some MAJOR, BIG-LEAGUE donors none of it happens. Where is the money? The school does NOT have it. The state won't fund it. A bond measure won't pass, and as a university employee who works directly with students every day, I feel fairly confident in saying they will not vote to pay more for upgrades.

IF the big-time money is found and donated...that's all good and well. But until then, Coach K is going to have to win with what he's got...with the exception of some small improvements made every year. In other words..."if you build it (a winning program), they (major donors) will come."

IMHO...

Bad news, Jer, I only got two of the power ball numbers in Saturday's drawing. Good news -- the pots up to $245 M this week!!!!
 
Do you mean my $750 to the Bengal Foundation every year doesn't count as big money?? I guess I'll play the lottery this week as well, I'd really like to help with some major upgrades to the facilities.

If 20,000 of us gave $1,000 then we'd have $20M for upgrades to the Dome - who's in?
 
Skippy said:
votb said:
This is all a really nice discussion...the chicken or the egg. But that's not the real story. The real story is that right now, without some MAJOR, BIG-LEAGUE donors none of it happens. Where is the money? The school does NOT have it. The state won't fund it. A bond measure won't pass, and as a university employee who works directly with students every day, I feel fairly confident in saying they will not vote to pay more for upgrades.

IF the big-time money is found and donated...that's all good and well. But until then, Coach K is going to have to win with what he's got...with the exception of some small improvements made every year. In other words..."if you build it (a winning program), they (major donors) will come."

IMHO...

Bad news, Jer, I only got two of the power ball numbers in Saturday's drawing. Good news -- the pots up to $245 M this week!!!!

You Go, Brad!
 
bengalguy said:
Do you mean my $750 to the Bengal Foundation every year doesn't count as big money?? I guess I'll play the lottery this week as well, I'd really like to help with some major upgrades to the facilities.

If 20,000 of us gave $1,000 then we'd have $20M for upgrades to the Dome - who's in?



I like it!
 
votb said:
IF the big-time money is found and donated...that's all good and well. But until then, Coach K is going to have to win with what he's got...with the exception of some small improvements made every year. In other words..."if you build it (a winning program), they (major donors) will come."

IMHO...

Trust me, from a football standpoint, the knock on the dome has always been about the turf. When other coaches have recruited against ISU, they used the turf to dissuade recruits.

The new turf ranks up there with the best in the nation. It's not the negative factor it used to be. The lockerrooms and weight room also rank very good for FCS football.

The dome needs renovations. No argument there. But does a player on the field really care that the concessions suck? Does he really care that the bathroom situation is bad? The poor press box? This administration took care of the important factors as far as recruitment goes. Win and you can start to upgrade the other items.

Show the recruits the turf, the lockerrooms, the weight room, and 90% of your battle is done. Show them a clip of the hostile environment from the UNC or PSU home games, and then compare that to the almost sterile environment of some other conference away games. PSU plays in a great facility, but what factor do 6,000 fans have spread out in a 20,000 seat stadium? UNC, EWU, and even SUU are smaller stadiums which don't capture crowd energy at all.

If you know any Big Sky players who have come in here in the past, ask them what the beef was with Holt. It was the turf.
 
JJB said:
votb said:
IF the big-time money is found and donated...that's all good and well. But until then, Coach K is going to have to win with what he's got...with the exception of some small improvements made every year. In other words..."if you build it (a winning program), they (major donors) will come."

IMHO...

Trust me, from a football standpoint, the knock on the dome has always been about the turf. When other coaches have recruited against ISU, they used the turf to dissuade recruits.

The new turf ranks up there with the best in the nation. It's not the negative factor it used to be. The lockerrooms and weight room also rank very good for FCS football.

The dome needs renovations. No argument there. But does a player on the field really care that the concessions suck? Does he really care that the bathroom situation is bad? The poor press box? This administration took care of the important factors as far as recruitment goes. Win and you can start to upgrade the other items.

Show the recruits the turf, the lockerrooms, the weight room, and 90% of your battle is done. Show them a clip of the hostile environment from the UNC or PSU home games, and then compare that to the almost sterile environment of some other conference away games. PSU plays in a great facility, but what factor do 6,000 fans have spread out in a 20,000 seat stadium? UNC, EWU, and even SUU are smaller stadiums which don't capture crowd energy at all.

If you know any Big Sky players who have come in here in the past, ask them what the beef was with Holt. It was the turf.

I could not agree more. I've visited all of these venues, including EWU both before and after their renovations, and the dome really isn't that bad. Kramer turned two programs around with poor facilities and I strongly believe that we are a sleeping giant in the Big Sky Conference. All you have to do is look at the way the attendance went up after we put two wins together. Resources and funding would start to appear if we could put back to back winning seasons together.
 
I'd like to third this motion.. We need to start pulling recruits like Lewis did, and this thing will turn around. Enough excuses to why it cannot be done..
 
I think that EWU has a big recruiting advantage that we don't have -- a natural recruiting base, in that they can go into the heavily populated Seattle-Tacoma area, and get lots of good recruits that Washington or Wash. St. don't want, or they may not academically qualify for those schools. My aunt is a counselor for Eisenhower High in Yakima, and she says that EWU is a lot easier to get into than those two other schools. Plus there's just a handful of colleges that an athlete can play college football for in Washington.
 
tuffgong said:
I'd like to third this motion.. We need to start pulling recruits like Lewis did, and this thing will turn around. Enough excuses to why it cannot be done..

Not to make any excuses Tuff, because there are no excuses in football, but...a lot of those Lewis recruits would not qualify under the new higher academic standards now in place at ISU. I think this is going to be a slower rebuild. Not that it can't be done, and hopefully this one will build a more solid foundation and last a lot longer.
 

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