Idaho State's Derek Graves banned

[HannahO]

There's so much wrong with this story but I think the thing that bothered me the most was when Graves said in an interview that he immediately went into the meeting room and used his cell phone to record the incident from the practice film so he could provide it to his lawyer. His words ... and they say volumes about his motivation in this. Kramer was foolish, Graves appears opportunistic, greedy, and a bit deceitful regarding both his "fall"/dive and the extent of his injury (can anyone say whiplash?).

Hannah, you always express things perfectly. I agree with this 100%. Well done!

Thanks, well chosen words, used concisely - it was drilled into me oh so many years ago and has stood the test of time and profession (and even the Internet bahahaha)!

 

[Screamin_Eagle174]

There's so much wrong with this story but I think the thing that bothered me the most was when Graves said in an interview that he immediately went into the meeting room and used his cell phone to record the incident from the practice film so he could provide it to his lawyer. His words ... and they say volumes about his motivation in this. Kramer was foolish, Graves appears opportunistic, greedy, and a bit deceitful regarding both his "fall"/dive and the extent of his injury (can anyone say whiplash?).

Hannah, you always express things perfectly. I agree with this 100%. Well done!

Thanks, well chosen words, used concisely - it was drilled into me oh so many years ago and has stood the test of time and profession (and even the Internet bahahaha)!

It generally takes time and a well-concerted effort for me to get my message across in concise and eloquent fashion, which is why it rarely happens over the internet. :lol:

 

[MLEagle]

I don't know. I think we sometimes forget that these are kids out there. If Graves had ran across the field and shoved Kramer for something so inconsequential, he'd be off the team in a heartbeat. And no one would bat an eye. College coaches wield an incredible amount of influence and power. A big part of their job is to build these boys up, especially considering almost all of them will go on to be a pro in something other than football.

In college football, winning is paramount. But a huge part of their job is to guide young men. That's while I'd take a Baldwin, Best or graham over a Wulff or Kramer any day.

Just my opinion I guess.

Kramer is a good guy. Hard ass? Yes. And in today's day and age, this is what happens. Some candy ass little kid gets shown up and sues. This is a different world. You see guys missing 6 weeks for injuries that you would hardly have missed a series for 10 years ago. I'm not sure this softer environment has made anything better.

I'm all in favor of taking necessary precautions for head injuries. We've evolved to see how serious those can be. But this kid needing two weeks FOR THIS? It's getting downright weird.

I say BS to this, These kids are not some piece of meat to go out there and tear their bodies up, and then be left to fend for them selves. I know one of the guys who has missed 6 weeks Zack Johnson would love nothing better than to be out there competing with his teammates. Your body is your lively hood so dont let some dip shit blogger make you think you are doing something wrong.

As for pushing a kid down, what a complete dumbass coach, any coach in America from little league to college should know you dont put your habds on a kid in this day and age. He should be fired and sued in civil court as the coach is a representitive of the university. The university has deep pockets. Their has to be some reason this dumbass coach keeps himself in the news and it isnt about his winning on the field.

If that were my son, legal action would be the least of the coaches problems.

Kramer was wrong period. However, I disagree with you and anyone else who wants to run out at the drop of a hat, lawyer up, and sue for everything that happens; there are a lot of rich attorneys that love this attitude though.

There are a lot of ways to right wrongs that happen, but it is evident to me that the kid is trying to destroy Kramer for a lot of reasons other then being shoved on a college football field. I have no idea what his reasons are or if they are valid, but the reasons are not for this isolated incident.

If this happened to my son I would hope that he would stand up for himself, try every other reasonable option to get justice, and the lawsuit would be the last option.

 

[EWURanger]

I don't know. I think we sometimes forget that these are kids out there. If Graves had ran across the field and shoved Kramer for something so inconsequential, he'd be off the team in a heartbeat. And no one would bat an eye. College coaches wield an incredible amount of influence and power. A big part of their job is to build these boys up, especially considering almost all of them will go on to be a pro in something other than football.

In college football, winning is paramount. But a huge part of their job is to guide young men. That's while I'd take a Baldwin, Best or graham over a Wulff or Kramer any day.

Just my opinion I guess.

Kramer is a good guy. Hard ass? Yes. And in today's day and age, this is what happens. Some candy ass little kid gets shown up and sues. This is a different world. You see guys missing 6 weeks for injuries that you would hardly have missed a series for 10 years ago. I'm not sure this softer environment has made anything better.

I'm all in favor of taking necessary precautions for head injuries. We've evolved to see how serious those can be. But this kid needing two weeks FOR THIS? It's getting downright weird.

I say BS to this, These kids are not some piece of meat to go out there and tear their bodies up, and then be left to fend for them selves. I know one of the guys who has missed 6 weeks Zack Johnson would love nothing better than to be out there competing with his teammates. Your body is your lively hood so dont let some dip shit blogger make you think you are doing something wrong.

As for pushing a kid down, what a complete dumbass coach, any coach in America from little league to college should know you dont put your habds on a kid in this day and age. He should be fired and sued in civil court as the coach is a representitive of the university. The university has deep pockets. Their has to be some reason this dumbass coach keeps himself in the news and it isnt about his winning on the field.

If that were my son, legal action would be the least of the coaches problems.

Kramer was wrong period. However, I disagree with you and anyone else who wants to run out at the drop of a hat, lawyer up, and sue for everything that happens; there are a lot of rich attorneys that love this attitude though.

There are a lot of ways to right wrongs that happen, but it is evident to me that the kid is trying to destroy Kramer for a lot of reasons other then being shoved on a college football field. I have no idea what his reasons are or if they are valid, but the reasons are not for this isolated incident.

If this happened to my son I would hope that he would stand up for himself, try every other reasonable option to get justice, and the lawsuit would be the last option.

Exactly. I think Kramer was wrong in this incident and clearly needs to have more situational awareness, but I also think the way the kid went about this whole thing was pretty slimey. He stated from the beginning that it was about his pride and that the HC had punked him. Bottom line is he got Alpha-maled and didn't like it.

Kramer was in the wrong, but so is this kid in the way he dealt with it. No way that little push caused these myriad of injuries that he's claiming happened. Come on, does anyone seriously believe that it did?

 

[jtayewu]

I don't know. I think we sometimes forget that these are kids out there.

I will disagree with you here. These aren't kids, they are grown ass men. These people are the same age as those that I served with in the Corps, deployed to Iraq with and who have lost their lives doing so. They aren't kids...well maybe mentally in some cases.

Edit: We were lucky that none of the Marines I went with lost their lives, however I know those who did.

I just feel that the longer we treat these adults as "kids" and excuse their actions as them being kids, the longer they will act like it. They are adults and should behave as such.

 

[Screamin_Eagle174]

I don't know. I think we sometimes forget that these are kids out there.

I will disagree with you here. These aren't kids, they are grown ass men. These people are the same age as those that I served with in the Corps, deployed to Iraq with and who have lost their lives doing so. They aren't kids...well maybe mentally in some cases.

EXCELLENT post.

 

[BLACKFALKIN1]

You guys take this shtt to far sometimes. You dot push a fxcking player to the point where he falls on the ground idgaf who you are. The coach is 100% wrong and action shd have been taken against him. Classless dirtbag taking his frustration with that sorry ass team out on 1 player is complete bullshtt.

 

[Rjones61]

You guys take this shtt to far sometimes. You dot push a fxcking player to the point where he falls on the ground idgaf who you are. The coach is 100% wrong and action shd have been taken against him. Classless dirtbag taking his frustration with that sorry ass team out on 1 player is complete bullshtt.

Drunk uke:

 

[FormerEag]

I don't know. I think we sometimes forget that these are kids out there.

I will disagree with you here. These aren't kids, they are grown ass men. These people are the same age as those that I served with in the Corps, deployed to Iraq with and who have lost their lives doing so. They aren't kids...well maybe mentally in some cases.

Edit: We were lucky that none of the Marines I went with lost their lives, however I know those who did.

I just feel that the longer we treat these adults as "kids" and excuse their actions as them being kids, the longer they will act like it. They are adults and should behave as such.

And I, in turn, disagree with you. Training 18 year olds (who I would define as kids) to fight and potentially die in a war is not even close to the same thing as coaching them to play a game. Especially at a smaller state college. Kramer was plain wrong and certainly has a documented history of this behavior. And even though the kid went about it the wrong way. But something motivated him to make this move and i suspect it is the way Kramer conducts himself regularly.

I've heard many stories about Kramers time at EWU that would back this up. But what do I know.

Bottom line, as an employee of a state university, you don't lay your hands on a student or "grown ass man" that way. That is incredibly stupid and show incredibly poor leadership.