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The PAC/MWC Dominoes Begin to Fall

While, as all y'all know, I'm completely against this from the get-go, I'd be interested to hear their rationale for denying the petition given the weak FBS move-ups (and, no, I'm not talking about JMU, CCU, and Liberty in that classification; while I would still prefer to have them in FCS land, they HAVE proven their worth in FBS) in the last ten years. There's no way in heck that the likes of GA State and Jax State are better than the Hornets, either in terms of football performance or in terms of overall athletic and academic performance....
 
Kadeezy said:
Need a serious response from the administration, NOW to control the narrative and to stop any potential exodus of recruits/portalers.
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These folks are on the roster until the winter portal and those that excel on the field are likely going to bounce to a "better" program anyways. Until the portal rules change, it's going to be a rotating roster on an annual basis. I suppose some players can "redshirt" if they have it available but at the end of the day all these players are here to play for Coach Marion and we were going to be an FCS program in '25 regardless of how this all shakes out.
 
Hornet25 said:
Brutal. Could be that the committee expects there to be a new governing body in place next week and they don't want to drop a decision on their desk that may not have any relevance because the process has changed.

Or the FBS schools hate us.
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Yeah not sure how this will all work out now. I thought today's committee was an actual vote but it's just a recommendation to the D1 Council. Still bad news and I'd be surprised if the D1 Council goes in a different direction with the decision on our FBS waiver. It will be interesting to see how Dr. Wood responds, if it all goes sideways I hope he gets some lawfare going as I would think there are some anti-trust implications with this whole situation.

Here's an interesting post on the bigger picture. Given the pending D1 governance up for approval, our whole situation could be moot if there is some fluidity built into the reclassification of D1 football to accommodate the House Agreement fallout. I guess we won't have a definitive answer on our situation until the middle of next week.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1934742493750546816
 
the Rat said:
Silence from J Street so far. But Josh Woods did weigh in on X.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1934805833231266033

Level up in a gritty way? Not sure what that means between now and next week.

You would think this is a big story for local media. Nothing from KCRA 3, Sac Bee, Joe Davidson or sactownsports.com, as far as I can find.
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The media weren’t expecting much, plus they already have a FBS team identified for the region and it’s their preferred program. Jump on the FUCD train! Already in a FBS conference, R1, facilities and $$$$$.

Meanwhile Sac State is regressing wanting to join the Big Worst and still without facilities. Except for the stadium ribbon board, which hasn’t been ordered from Amazon yet. Oh, and the collapsible seat Gymboree which was due to be completed in May.

Gritty way=actually build permanent facilities, actually win a trophy in the big 2 sports nationally, actually have 20,000+ in football and 3,500+ in basketball attendance YoY.

No smoke and mirrors and (c)rap song ‘look at me’.
 
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https://twitter.com/x/status/1935071377545175414

"The committee recommends the NCAA Division I Council deny the institution’s request to waive the required bona fide invitation from an active FBS conference. The committee noted a conference invitation is of paramount importance for entering into the reclassification process because the invitation signals an institution’s readiness to enter the process."
 
Sounds like we met all the FBS metrics and the "you can't because you need an invite" is the only reason for the recommended denial. Considering that there currently are and historically have been FBS programs operating as an independent, I wonder if there are grounds for an antitrust lawsuit if our application is denied by the D1 Council.
 
The second reason cited is “Lack of compelling mitigation,” which means Sac State's excuse for a waiver isn't good enough. Whatever that means...
 
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SDHornet said:
Sounds like we met all the FBS metrics and the "you can't because you need an invite" is the only reason for the recommended denial. Considering that there currently are and historically have been FBS programs operating as an independent, I wonder if there are grounds for an antitrust lawsuit if our application is denied by the D1 Council.
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I also can't see the need for any conference to throw Dr. Wood a lifeline this year or next.
 
the Rat said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1935071377545175414

"The committee recommends the NCAA Division I Council deny the institution’s request to waive the required bona fide invitation from an active FBS conference. The committee noted a conference invitation is of paramount importance for entering into the reclassification process because the invitation signals an institution’s readiness to enter the process."
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But Sam Houston and Missouri State are ready? Guess they are with modern facilities and a conference invite.
 
SDHornet said:
Sounds like we met all the FBS metrics and the "you can't because you need an invite" is the only reason for the recommended denial. Considering that there currently are and historically have been FBS programs operating as an independent, I wonder if there are grounds for an antitrust lawsuit if our application is denied by the D1 Council.
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UMass, UConn, Liberty are three that I know.
 
Green Cookie Monster said:
UMass, UConn, Liberty are three that I know.
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Uconn left AAC to rejoin Big East in 2020, paying $17 million exit fee. They had already won four national men’s bball championships. As for football, they became FBS in 2000. 20 years under their belt as FBS before becoming Independent.

UMass started their transition to FBS in 2011 with an invite from the MAC as a football-only member. UMass wanted their other sports in a difference conference and left the MAC after 2015. So they already had FBS status.

Liberty threatened to sue. They also have tons of money and great facilities.
 
It's not the facilities. Sam Houston States football stadium is garbage. It's the good old boys club who don't want to set a presidence of allowing teams to go FBS without an invite. They want full control over all the dollars.

Either way, it's bad politics by the committee. With so much time, money and capital expenses on this process, out of respect you let the school know ahead of time that you're not inclined to let them in so they can save face and save money. It appears Sac State was blind sided.
 
Hornet25 said:
It's not the facilities. Sam Houston States football stadium is garbage. It's the good old boys club who don't want to set a presidence of allowing teams to go FBS without an invite. They want full control over all the dollars.

Either way, it's bad politics by the committee. With so much time, money and capital expenses on this process, out of respect you let the school know ahead of time that you're not inclined to let them in so they can save face and save money. It appears Sac State was blind sided.
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NCAA might have notified them. But they were so damn the torpedo’s PacX or bust they threw away the potential chance to leverage a MWC invite before the dungpile. This is on Woods et al as no other program in the country has gone this route except Liberty. Who prints money and could litigate. What did Woods-Orr expect?

No PacX, no MWC, Sac State FBS anspirations are now a blip in time and burnt toast. No other FBS conference on the central/west of the USA to flash bang an invite.

What will FCS Indy provide? A purgatory. Body bag away games vs FBS and waning interest by the not really interested community in a program with no rudder.
 
HeavyistheClown said:
NCAA might have notified them. But they were so damn the torpedo’s PacX or bust they threw away the potential chance to leverage a MWC invite before the dungpile. This is on Woods et al as no other program in the country has gone this route except Liberty. Who prints money and could litigate. What did Woods-Orr expect?

No PacX, no MWC, Sac State FBS anspirations are now a blip in time and burnt toast. No other FBS conference on the central/west of the USA to flash bang an invite.

What will FCS Indy provide? A purgatory. Body bag away games vs FBS and waning interest by the not really interested community in a program with no rudder.
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The MW wasn't looking to add with FCS, possibly due to pressure/collusion from the P4 programs not to do so. Again, antitrust potential if there is documentation and/or statements from people in positions of power of such an implication.

I'm wary of FCS independence but IMO this BW/FCS Indy move means a few things:
  1. Dr. Wood is probably talking with his counsel, if he already hasn't, and is getting a lawsuit ready. It only takes a lawyer who wants to make a name for him/herself and one of many activist judges to have decent odds of being successful. Dr. Wood can include some of the wokenista narratives about how the system is keeping disenfranchised people of color away from opportunities for advancement/funds for good measure.
  2. We are withering away on the vine at FCS. The Sac area fan just doesn't get excited about FCS. We saw a bump in interest following our BSC Title threepeat but interest should have been much greater than what we saw. Let's not pretend like there is anything to gain by staying in the FCS, which is now exacerbated....
  3. With the BSC not opting in to the House Agreement and sticking to a 63 scholarship limit. With that move, we are now at odds with their governing approach as Dr. Wood has opted us in. By going FCS independent and opting in, we can have an "unlimited" football scholarship limit and a roster size of 105. Montana State, who has also opted in, is in this same predicament as us.
  4. BW is a much better Oly sports conference than the BSC. This isn't even debatable, and that's not even taking into consideration the cost savings in both time and money we'll see in reduced travel.
 
SDHornet said:
The MW wasn't looking to add with FCS, possibly due to pressure/collusion from the P4 programs not to do so. Again, antitrust potential if there is documentation and/or statements from people in positions of power of such an implication.

I'm wary of FCS independence but IMO this BW/FCS Indy move means a few things:
  1. Dr. Wood is probably talking with his counsel, if he already hasn't, and is getting a lawsuit ready. It only takes a lawyer who wants to make a name for him/herself and one of many activist judges to have decent odds of being successful. Dr. Wood can include some of the wokenista narratives about how the system is keeping disenfranchised people of color away from opportunities for advancement/funds for good measure.
  2. We are withering away on the vine at FCS. The Sac area fan just doesn't get excited about FCS. We saw a bump in interest following our BSC Title threepeat but interest should have been much greater than what we saw. Let's not pretend like there is anything to gain by staying in the FCS, which is now exacerbated....
  3. With the BSC not opting in to the House Agreement and sticking to a 63 scholarship limit. With that move, we are now at odds with their governing approach as Dr. Wood has opted us in. By going FCS independent and opting in, we can have an "unlimited" football scholarship limit and a roster size of 105. Montana State, who has also opted in, is in this same predicament as us.
  4. BW is a much better Oly sports conference than the BSC. This isn't even debatable, and that's not even taking into consideration the cost savings in both time and money we'll see in reduced travel.
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If going to the MWC meant keeping football at FCS level, then we would be golden.

Already in a FBS conference, and the NCAA wouldn’t have had an issue. Just upgrading the program to fit the MWC peer schools.

But we shunned the MWC because Wood was to rabid on PacX. Meanwhile the PacX just laughed.

If the BW is so great, why did Davis move away from that direction? They played chess while Wood played chutes and ladders.

Now Sac is in football hell. We only got $100,000 from BSC, but at least they had a trophy/ring to play for. As an Indy, no postseason, no trophy and only being paid half to play away FBS games.

What about this magical ‘26 schedule Orr had put together? Any contracts signed with FBS teams? More money lost. NIL gone, players gone, coach gone, pride comes before a fall and Sac State fell to the literal bottom.
 
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