PSU Athletics?

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Alan
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Joined: July 27th, 2015, 3:10 pm
Favorite School: OCE

Pounder wrote: August 9th, 2022, 1:14 am
Alan wrote: August 8th, 2022, 3:15 pm That is correct @bigskyconf. Just like our basketball teams PSU needs to be playing football in the same neighborhood as our park blocks campus. Regardless of the spectator capacity we should cut a deal with PPS to play at the new Lincoln HS stadium. In the meantime lobby the Portland City Commission to see that PSU football has low cost access to Providence Park as a condition of Paulson's lease of the city facility. PSU is a big player in the city and we should act like it.
Frankly, big players own their facilities. Renting has always been problem 1.

Big players would have never backed out in the first place.

I’m still 70% serious about the community field idea. The key is that it puts PSU in an ownership position while linking the limited space to build anything to the current proven way to draw a crowd.
@pounder, I wrote: "PSU is a big player in the city and we should act like it." The problem is we don't act like it. And, yes owning is much better than renting. I'll buy you community field idea especially since I'm considerably older than 21 and am close enough to walk home from the game.
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Pounder
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Location: The Outskirts of Nutria Nanny

Alan wrote: August 11th, 2022, 4:41 pm @pounder, I wrote: "PSU is a big player in the city and we should act like it." The problem is we don't act like it. And, yes owning is much better than renting. I'll buy you community field idea especially since I'm considerably older than 21 and am close enough to walk home from the game.
Portland State, the university, is a big player.

Portland State, the athletic department, is another matter, and really has very few resources to work with. Moreover, if you take the most well worn path of a school with an AD with limited capacity, will the students vote for an athletics fee increase?

I’m not here to fight against moving back downtown as a concept. If that happens, it’s with a greater sunk cost than if you build something out in Hillsboro, for instance. And there’s risk, as Cal-Berkeley can attest, sinking $321 million into a stadium rebuild and seeing very little come from it.

My argument to you is that this is a process. You need the beer garden to generate the interest, the interest to generate a “why can’t this be closer to campus” complaint, and work from there. Right now, building just to build doesn’t even appear to be worth the risk.
bigskyconf
Posts: 2019
Joined: September 6th, 2014, 4:09 pm
Favorite School: portland state

Pounder wrote: August 12th, 2022, 12:54 pm My argument to you is that this is a process. You need the beer garden to generate the interest, the interest to generate a “why can’t this be closer to campus” complaint, and work from there. Right now, building just to build doesn’t even appear to be worth the risk.
We don't need a beer garden to generate interest. We just need to win. Winning cures everything. Winning at the DII level is what propelled us to DI in the first place. Once we win on a consistent basis, more people will want to come out. More people coming out, more people making the trip to Hillsboro. After awhile, more people are wondering, as you say, "why can't this be closer".

All the gimmicks in the world won't get the Gresham supporters to Hillsboro, but winning consistently and having a winning program will.
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scooter
Posts: 270
Joined: May 20th, 2009, 1:13 pm
Favorite School: Portland State

bigskyconf wrote: August 15th, 2022, 10:27 am
Pounder wrote: August 12th, 2022, 12:54 pm My argument to you is that this is a process. You need the beer garden to generate the interest, the interest to generate a “why can’t this be closer to campus” complaint, and work from there. Right now, building just to build doesn’t even appear to be worth the risk.
We don't need a beer garden to generate interest. We just need to win. Winning cures everything. Winning at the DII level is what propelled us to DI in the first place. Once we win on a consistent basis, more people will want to come out. More people coming out, more people making the trip to Hillsboro. After awhile, more people are wondering, as you say, "why can't this be closer".

All the gimmicks in the world won't get the Gresham supporters to Hillsboro, but winning consistently and having a winning program will.
THIS is the truth !
We are all we have, we are all we need!
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Pounder
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bigskyconf wrote: August 15th, 2022, 10:27 am
Pounder wrote: August 12th, 2022, 12:54 pm My argument to you is that this is a process. You need the beer garden to generate the interest, the interest to generate a “why can’t this be closer to campus” complaint, and work from there. Right now, building just to build doesn’t even appear to be worth the risk.
We don't need a beer garden to generate interest. We just need to win. Winning cures everything. Winning at the DII level is what propelled us to DI in the first place. Once we win on a consistent basis, more people will want to come out. More people coming out, more people making the trip to Hillsboro. After awhile, more people are wondering, as you say, "why can't this be closer".

All the gimmicks in the world won't get the Gresham supporters to Hillsboro, but winning consistently and having a winning program will.
I’m still looking at this from the standpoint of when PSU made the D-2 playoffs in the late 80s and 20,000 people showed up more than once, then in 2015 PSU hosts an FCS playoff game and 8,022 are there.

I want to believe you’re right, but I don’t. I also know that, taking a look at some of the media attention, that there’s more buildup to this year than usual. But I’m not sure media delivers, anymore. Heck, even I’m researching cutting the cord. People have to know that you’re winning, first.
bigskyconf
Posts: 2019
Joined: September 6th, 2014, 4:09 pm
Favorite School: portland state

Pounder wrote: August 15th, 2022, 2:39 pm I’m still looking at this from the standpoint of when PSU made the D-2 playoffs in the late 80s and 20,000 people showed up more than once, then in 2015 PSU hosts an FCS playoff game and 8,022 are there.
I'm talking about consistent winning, not win one year then lay an egg the next. The success in the late 80's, early 90's during the Pokey Allen era was laid before that, with Mouse Davis and Don Read successes. Davis laid the foundation, Read went with it and it culminated with Allen. It never was one year great, then a series of years bad, then one year great again.

Had we been able to capitalize someway somehow, on the success of 2015 instead of going backwards in the years since, I guarantee PSU football (and PSU athletics) would look a whole lot different now.
Alan
Posts: 657
Joined: July 27th, 2015, 3:10 pm
Favorite School: OCE

bigskyconf wrote: August 15th, 2022, 3:30 pm
Pounder wrote: August 15th, 2022, 2:39 pm I’m still looking at this from the standpoint of when PSU made the D-2 playoffs in the late 80s and 20,000 people showed up more than once, then in 2015 PSU hosts an FCS playoff game and 8,022 are there.
I'm talking about consistent winning, not win one year then lay an egg the next. The success in the late 80's, early 90's during the Pokey Allen era was laid before that, with Mouse Davis and Don Read successes. Davis laid the foundation, Read went with it and it culminated with Allen. It never was one year great, then a series of years bad, then one year great again.

Had we been able to capitalize someway somehow, on the success of 2015 instead of going backwards in the years since, I guarantee PSU football (and PSU athletics) would look a whole lot different now.
So @bigskyconf, how do we get from where we are to "...consistent winning...."? Asking for a friend.
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scooter
Posts: 270
Joined: May 20th, 2009, 1:13 pm
Favorite School: Portland State

Alan, I'll be your friend here.

I'm not convinced that the talent disparity between the Big Sky clubs is such that the same teams, year after year, become perennial favorites.

2015 was NOT Barnum's team. He has had 6 years to build a truly competitive program, and here we are barely treading water. Every year there is some extenuating circumstance that allows him to declare "well if it weren't for..." . This year it will be a new QB. I've been a season ticket holder since Pokey's second year, and this breaks my heart. We have I believe 17 returning starters this year, some All American talent, fantastic depth in most positions, and the rest of world anticipates we'll end up in 8th, 9th place? WTF ?
We are all we have, we are all we need!
bigskyconf
Posts: 2019
Joined: September 6th, 2014, 4:09 pm
Favorite School: portland state

Alan wrote: August 15th, 2022, 5:12 pm
bigskyconf wrote: August 15th, 2022, 3:30 pm
Pounder wrote: August 15th, 2022, 2:39 pm I’m still looking at this from the standpoint of when PSU made the D-2 playoffs in the late 80s and 20,000 people showed up more than once, then in 2015 PSU hosts an FCS playoff game and 8,022 are there.
I'm talking about consistent winning, not win one year then lay an egg the next. The success in the late 80's, early 90's during the Pokey Allen era was laid before that, with Mouse Davis and Don Read successes. Davis laid the foundation, Read went with it and it culminated with Allen. It never was one year great, then a series of years bad, then one year great again.

Had we been able to capitalize someway somehow, on the success of 2015 instead of going backwards in the years since, I guarantee PSU football (and PSU athletics) would look a whole lot different now.
So @bigskyconf, how do we get from where we are to "...consistent winning...."? Asking for a friend.
Baby steps. It isn't going to happen overnight. Just improve on the previous seasons, making sure the next season is better than the last, and don't lose sight of the ultimate goal. Make sure that a season like 2015 becomes the normal and not the exception. For as good as 2015 was, we still lost a home playoff game. The goal for 2016 should have been not only make the playoffs, but win a playoff game. Heck, that should have been the goal since 2015, but many, myself included, would now accept a winning season. Which is OK, as long as we improve on it next season.

There was a buzz in the city after our 2015 season and we failed to capitalize on it. Winning will start the buzz again. Next time we need to build on it.
Alan
Posts: 657
Joined: July 27th, 2015, 3:10 pm
Favorite School: OCE

scooter wrote: August 15th, 2022, 8:50 pm Alan, I'll be your friend here.

I'm not convinced that the talent disparity between the Big Sky clubs is such that the same teams, year after year, become perennial favorites.

2015 was NOT Barnum's team. He has had 6 years to build a truly competitive program, and here we are barely treading water. Every year there is some extenuating circumstance that allows him to declare "well if it weren't for..." . This year it will be a new QB. I've been a season ticket holder since Pokey's second year, and this breaks my heart. We have I believe 17 returning starters this year, some All American talent, fantastic depth in most positions, and the rest of world anticipates we'll end up in 8th, 9th place? WTF ?
"[Barnham] has had 6 years to build a truly competitive program, and here we are barely treading water. " I believe you have hit the nail on the head. During his tenure we lost our downtown venue, our radio coverage, and our way. We need new direction at the head of the program.
Alan
Posts: 657
Joined: July 27th, 2015, 3:10 pm
Favorite School: OCE

bigskyconf wrote: August 16th, 2022, 2:19 pm
Alan wrote: August 15th, 2022, 5:12 pm
bigskyconf wrote: August 15th, 2022, 3:30 pm
Pounder wrote: August 15th, 2022, 2:39 pm I’m still looking at this from the standpoint of when PSU made the D-2 playoffs in the late 80s and 20,000 people showed up more than once, then in 2015 PSU hosts an FCS playoff game and 8,022 are there.
I'm talking about consistent winning, not win one year then lay an egg the next. The success in the late 80's, early 90's during the Pokey Allen era was laid before that, with Mouse Davis and Don Read successes. Davis laid the foundation, Read went with it and it culminated with Allen. It never was one year great, then a series of years bad, then one year great again.

Had we been able to capitalize someway somehow, on the success of 2015 instead of going backwards in the years since, I guarantee PSU football (and PSU athletics) would look a whole lot different now.
So @bigskyconf, how do we get from where we are to "...consistent winning...."? Asking for a friend.
Baby steps. It isn't going to happen overnight. Just improve on the previous seasons, making sure the next season is better than the last, and don't lose sight of the ultimate goal. Make sure that a season like 2015 becomes the normal and not the exception. For as good as 2015 was, we still lost a home playoff game. The goal for 2016 should have been not only make the playoffs, but win a playoff game. Heck, that should have been the goal since 2015, but many, myself included, would now accept a winning season. Which is OK, as long as we improve on it next season.

There was a buzz in the city after our 2015 season and we failed to capitalize on it. Winning will start the buzz again. Next time we need to build on it.
I would agree. The question is who is going to manage those "baby steps." Like @scooter said: "[Barnham] has had 6 years to build a truly competitive program, and here we are barely treading water. "
bigskyconf
Posts: 2019
Joined: September 6th, 2014, 4:09 pm
Favorite School: portland state

scooter wrote: August 15th, 2022, 8:50 pm We have I believe 17 returning starters this year, some All American talent, fantastic depth in most positions, and the rest of world anticipates we'll end up in 8th, 9th place? WTF ?
It is similar to the Blazers. There is a lot of unknowns at key positions that is keeping the national pundits from rating us so high. The fanbase thinks everything will be good and we should be higher, yet the national media usually take a cautious approach. The quarterback is what stirs the drink in the Big Sky and success in the conference is usually determined on how fast they can get up to speed. On paper, Montana is in the same boat that we are, but they get more love based on their proven success. The Grizzlies have four impact starters on defense (we have two), but they don't really have any impact returnees on offense (we have one). They are also breaking in a new quarterback. That is why I think our game at Missoula is more important than people realize. Whoever wins that game will be fine, while the loser will probably struggle the rest of the year.
bigskyconf
Posts: 2019
Joined: September 6th, 2014, 4:09 pm
Favorite School: portland state

Alan wrote: August 17th, 2022, 9:52 am
bigskyconf wrote: August 16th, 2022, 2:19 pm
Alan wrote: August 15th, 2022, 5:12 pm
bigskyconf wrote: August 15th, 2022, 3:30 pm
Pounder wrote: August 15th, 2022, 2:39 pm I’m still looking at this from the standpoint of when PSU made the D-2 playoffs in the late 80s and 20,000 people showed up more than once, then in 2015 PSU hosts an FCS playoff game and 8,022 are there.
I'm talking about consistent winning, not win one year then lay an egg the next. The success in the late 80's, early 90's during the Pokey Allen era was laid before that, with Mouse Davis and Don Read successes. Davis laid the foundation, Read went with it and it culminated with Allen. It never was one year great, then a series of years bad, then one year great again.

Had we been able to capitalize someway somehow, on the success of 2015 instead of going backwards in the years since, I guarantee PSU football (and PSU athletics) would look a whole lot different now.
So @bigskyconf, how do we get from where we are to "...consistent winning...."? Asking for a friend.
Baby steps. It isn't going to happen overnight. Just improve on the previous seasons, making sure the next season is better than the last, and don't lose sight of the ultimate goal. Make sure that a season like 2015 becomes the normal and not the exception. For as good as 2015 was, we still lost a home playoff game. The goal for 2016 should have been not only make the playoffs, but win a playoff game. Heck, that should have been the goal since 2015, but many, myself included, would now accept a winning season. Which is OK, as long as we improve on it next season.

There was a buzz in the city after our 2015 season and we failed to capitalize on it. Winning will start the buzz again. Next time we need to build on it.
I would agree. The question is who is going to manage those "baby steps." Like @scooter said: "[Barnham] has had 6 years to build a truly competitive program, and here we are barely treading water. "
It has to come from the AD. And keep in mind we are not talking just about football, but about all sports as well. The AD needs to have a clear goal for success for all the sports, and a plan for how to get there. If a sport is lagging, maybe some changes are in order. The AD needs to know that PSU athletics encompasses 1 of 3 DI football programs in the state, and 1 of 4 DI basketball programs in the state. This isn't a club level job, this is a top flight, highly lucrative, NCAA sanctioned athletic program and it needs to be directed as such.
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Pounder
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bigskyconf wrote: August 17th, 2022, 10:34 am It has to come from the AD. And keep in mind we are not talking just about football, but about all sports as well. The AD needs to have a clear goal for success for all the sports, and a plan for how to get there. If a sport is lagging, maybe some changes are in order. The AD needs to know that PSU athletics encompasses 1 of 3 DI football programs in the state, and 1 of 4 DI basketball programs in the state. This isn't a club level job, this is a top flight, highly lucrative, NCAA sanctioned athletic program and it needs to be directed as such.
And it appears more than possible that the Multnomah Athletic Club pays better.
bigskyconf
Posts: 2019
Joined: September 6th, 2014, 4:09 pm
Favorite School: portland state

Pounder wrote: August 17th, 2022, 12:57 pm
bigskyconf wrote: August 17th, 2022, 10:34 am It has to come from the AD. And keep in mind we are not talking just about football, but about all sports as well. The AD needs to have a clear goal for success for all the sports, and a plan for how to get there. If a sport is lagging, maybe some changes are in order. The AD needs to know that PSU athletics encompasses 1 of 3 DI football programs in the state, and 1 of 4 DI basketball programs in the state. This isn't a club level job, this is a top flight, highly lucrative, NCAA sanctioned athletic program and it needs to be directed as such.
And it appears more than possible that the Multnomah Athletic Club pays better.
Quite possible. It is also possible that the MAC job is less demanding and/or less stressful. Who knows?
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Pounder
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Location: The Outskirts of Nutria Nanny

bigskyconf wrote: August 15th, 2022, 10:27 am
Pounder wrote: August 12th, 2022, 12:54 pm My argument to you is that this is a process. You need the beer garden to generate the interest, the interest to generate a “why can’t this be closer to campus” complaint, and work from there. Right now, building just to build doesn’t even appear to be worth the risk.
We don't need a beer garden to generate interest. We just need to win. Winning cures everything. Winning at the DII level is what propelled us to DI in the first place. Once we win on a consistent basis, more people will want to come out. More people coming out, more people making the trip to Hillsboro. After awhile, more people are wondering, as you say, "why can't this be closer".

All the gimmicks in the world won't get the Gresham supporters to Hillsboro, but winning consistently and having a winning program will.
I go back to this after a bunch of complaints in Boise about their staff not being paid well enough after some pandemic-based limitations were placed. Which came to a head last night when BSU didn’t simply lose… they got physically dominated. By UTEP.

But at least BSU can afford firing their OC, even though he’s under contract through next year. BTW… after resisting posting last night about how Davis Koetter may have made a mistake, his father is now the OC. Oh well.

This environment is increasingly a show-me-the-money environment. I feel safe in saying that the money has to arrive in order for the wins to manifest.
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