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6, 311....pathetic

P

Phantom Hornet

Active member
The attendance is dwindling with a pretty good product...who's fault is it at this point?

I have to put it squarely on the shoulders of the University. They have absolutely no marketing presence in this area of 2 million-plus besides a couple of billboards on the sides of buses.

How did the crappy Mountain Lions get 20k last weekend? Yes, Sacramentans love pro sports, even if its minor league, but part of it is that the Mountain Lions marketed the hell out of their product. TV commercials, radio, going downtown during the lunch rush and handing out free tickets to state workers (who love free things more than the average human). They did it all and it paid off.

First of all, Sac State has to get some sort of local TV package. That's paramount. I lost track of how many people I talked to who watched the game yesterday on Comcast. That's exposure.

Second, they have got to get out in the market, roll their sleeves up and get to work.

The fact of the matter is that in this area, there are a lot of things going on during a Saturday afternoon, and the University needs to show people why they should spend three hours at Hornet Field.

Thoughts?
 
What was the student turnout? I'm a Davis guy, who had a son who graduated from Sac in 2008...and...I was always disappointed there wasn't more student involvement (granted, the teams weren't very good). In contrast, his brother graduated from Davis in 2010 and missed maybe one home game and made several away games (again, to be fair, mom and dad are long time season ticket holder so that might influence things). our AggiePack is pretty strong, especially among the Freshmen. Our message board has many students.....it doesn't appear to be the case here. Hopefully, with success, its easier to drum up interest in the students, especially if there is a Hornet-Pack. there's no reason for Davis to draw more students than Sac. The undergrad populations are similar, and the demographics of Sac are much better suited to attending sporting events.

As for the greater Sac fanbase....i'm not sure how you win that group over. I was shocked to see 20,000 at the UFL game. Did they market that strongly? One thing that i think hurts is that the Sac sports radio is KHTK, home of Davis football.....and...they basically ignore the Ags, and it would be a step-up for them just to ignore the Hornets. Lots of ignorance there. Losing the local noon-time radio (Jim Kozimor) hurts too...he was in tune with local college sports (often doing the Comcast broadcasts) and i think he'd be giving you guys some publicity.

It will be interesting to see what Davis draws next week for homecoming, coming off a win over San Jose. Probably close to 10,000. A win there, and the next win should draw close to 10,000. Causeway will be packed. Southern Utah? Depends on our record at that time (its the time of the quarter when alot of kids head home).

Again...I'm the one Davis fan who roots for Sac every weekend but one! Love to see you guys start filling the place up. Having two good, well-supported teams competing in the same league...that might lead to more local Comcast or Sac-area station broadcasts.
 
I didn't expect too many fans at yesterday's game considering the 1:00 start time and the heat. Had it been at the original 6:00 start it would have been better. Apparently Montana State requested the time change to accommodate their TV coverage, at least that's what they said on the radio pregame. It's really too bad, it was a entertaining game and another courageous effort by the Hornets. I think that generally the attendance is hurt by a couple of issues.

1. The visiting BSC teams don't appeal to the California market. Not saying they are not good athletically, there is just not the connection there. Even Montana, at the time #1 in FCS played Cal Poly before 8,000 in SLO. When we played Poly in SLO last year, same week we drew 10,300. The opponent don't make that much difference to me, like many hard core Hornet fans on this board I go to every home game to watch the Hornets, regardless of who the opponent is. It is unrealistic to expect to attract casual Hornet fans or new Hornet fans to make the choice to attend unless there is a compelling reason to do so. There are a lot of entertainment and activity choices out there, you have to compete for the public's time and money by offering a attractive product and promoting it. There is a possibility that with davis and Poly coming into the BSC that there will be more California interaction and awareness of the BSC teams.

2. There is apparently little if any marketing or promotion in place to increase attendance. If we have marketing and promotion people employed I don't know what they are doing for their money. As GCM pointed out the promotion web page has been dormant for 3 years. Aside from a little blurb in the Alumni Newsletter there is no effort to sell season tickets. I tried to buy my season ticket at the Western Oregon game and was told they the ticket booth couldn't sell season tickets. You would think that selling season tickets would be a premium item for ticket sales but instead they seem content on selling $10.00 GA single game tickets to people who may or may not return for another game. There should be a well publicized drive to sell tickets in the spring or summer. I know that it takes money for marketing and promotions but the increase in income would outweigh the cost.

Some ideas: Why not make blocks of tickets available at discount to high school teams , non profits
or even businesses for resale? The non profits could use sales as a fund raiser. If you sold blocks of $10.00 tickets at say $3.00 each the seller would have the option of discounting them and selling them to benefit their activities. This would also help connect the community with the school. Even if Sac State would realize only $3.00 from a $10.00 face value ticket it would be better than letting the sun beat down on a empty seat and gaining nothing.
I realize that Sac State being a public institution may be reluctant to partner with outside groups even though it would benefit both. If they wanted to do it in house there are ways to do that at very little cost. Why not make a marketing effort as a project through the business department? I am sure that you could get students to take part at little or no expense. After all GCM and I worked on the stat crew for years while we were there for a Subway Sandwich, Pizza and soda at halftime and a occasional shirt! I went to the Mountain Lion Game last week. They must have spent a fortune promoting that and 20,000 showed up. it will be interesting to see how many show up next time. There whole deal was a little too glitzy for me but the continual promotion throughout the game had to be noticed. They seemed to have continuous tie in with local groups and businesses. There was no mention of Sac State, all references to Sac State where painted over on the field. Is there a way we could piggyback on that many people at our stadium, offer discount tickets, have a tent set up with Sac State information or at least have something announced?
It would seem we have some leverage with them. Last year their highest home attendance was 6,800 at AT & T in San Francisco , they drew only 4,800 for their game at San Jose State.

The athletic department, coaches and players have done a very good job to put an excellent product on the field, win or lose a team that we can all be proud of. It's a shame that more people don't come out and appreciate their efforts. Maybe some of our focus on the coaching decisions, players etc. should be redirected to questioning the athletic department on the lack of promotion of the program.
 
you have some good ideas -> maybe forward some to your marketing group and see what kind of reply you get.

you guys have to get the students out there.....hit the dorms, hit the frats, get them out, and give them a good showing, and they will be back.

by the way...you guys are now 1-3 in FCS/FBS games. does that mean you have to run the table to have a hope to get into the playoffs? or would 7-4 (with the WOU win) be enough? back to back road games at EWU and NAU will be a challange. seems like you have to hope to finish in the top 2 in the BigSky to get a bid, even with the expanded field.
 
And Liberty gets 19,300 for Savannah State?!? I understand it was the grand re-opening after a major renovation, but that's crazy.
 
Again, Sac State is plumb in the middle of a major metro market and they are a small fish trying to get noticed...the reality is that they have to actually put some work in to attract fans. Hell, the NBA Kings have struggled to sell tickets, even after lowering the prices, because the team is struggling.
 
Green Laser said:
There is apparently little if any marketing or promotion in place to increase attendance. If we have marketing and promotion people employed I don't know what they are doing for their money. As GCM pointed out the promotion web page has been dormant for 3 years. Aside from a little blurb in the Alumni Newsletter there is no effort to sell season tickets. I tried to buy my season ticket at the Western Oregon game and was told they the ticket booth couldn't sell season tickets. You would think that selling season tickets would be a premium item for ticket sales but instead they seem content on selling $10.00 GA single game tickets to people who may or may not return for another game. There should be a well publicized drive to sell tickets in the spring or summer. I know that it takes money for marketing and promotions but the increase in income would outweigh the cost.

Some ideas: Why not make blocks of tickets available at discount to high school teams , non profits
or even businesses for resale? The non profits could use sales as a fund raiser. If you sold blocks of $10.00 tickets at say $3.00 each the seller would have the option of discounting them and selling them to benefit their activities. This would also help connect the community with the school. Even if Sac State would realize only $3.00 from a $10.00 face value ticket it would be better than letting the sun beat down on a empty seat and gaining nothing.
I realize that Sac State being a public institution may be reluctant to partner with outside groups even though it would benefit both. If they wanted to do it in house there are ways to do that at very little cost. Why not make a marketing effort as a project through the business department? I am sure that you could get students to take part at little or no expense. After all GCM and I worked on the stat crew for years while we were there for a Subway Sandwich, Pizza and soda at halftime and a occasional shirt! I went to the Mountain Lion Game last week. They must have spent a fortune promoting that and 20,000 showed up. it will be interesting to see how many show up next time. There whole deal was a little too glitzy for me but the continual promotion throughout the game had to be noticed. They seemed to have continuous tie in with local groups and businesses. There was no mention of Sac State, all references to Sac State where painted over on the field. Is there a way we could piggyback on that many people at our stadium, offer discount tickets, have a tent set up with Sac State information or at least have something announced?
It would seem we have some leverage with them. Last year their highest home attendance was 6,800 at AT & T in San Francisco , they drew only 4,800 for their game at San Jose State.

The athletic department, coaches and players have done a very good job to put an excellent product on the field, win or lose a team that we can all be proud of. It's a shame that more people don't come out and appreciate their efforts. Maybe some of our focus on the coaching decisions, players etc. should be redirected to questioning the athletic department on the lack of promotion of the program.
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GL,

I contacted the "marketing dept" back in 07, and asked about 2 things:
1) Season ticket sales- was told the AD feels if you are going to be attending the event anyway, why dedicate resources to this activity. Seemed odd to me.
2) Having local HS days- Have a Folsom area day, a Roseville area day, etc. AND offer tickets at like 1/2 price to the schools, which they could sell at full price- you could bring a few local players onto the field at half time, etc.-- I was told the AD would NEVER do that. He feels that the product is good enough and if the locals should want to come. Worse, he said, the AD is not willing to reduce any seat prices, since that is the only revenue the program gets, and they could make shirts, etc and sell. I was told the Foundation gets ALL concessions and shares no revenue with athletics, so why would we want to fill the stadium so THEY could sell more concession items. I was thinking something stupid like 20k TICKETS times $6 = $120k vs 6800 x $10 = $68k, and felt my math was better, and was told no, it is not better.

HH
 
Super Hornet said:
And Liberty gets 19,300 for Savannah State?!? I understand it was the grand re-opening after a major renovation, but that's crazy.
Click to expand...

you think THAT'S crazy? we play South Alabama in 3 weeks. they are located in Mobile, 2nd year playing football, 1st year playing FCS teams and still have some JC-type schools on their schedule. they've played 3 games...here's the attendences:

vs. Pikeville (Ky) 22376
vs.Nichols State 23174
vs Kentucky Westlyn 18416

so....an average of, what, 20000 to play one horrible FCS team, a NAIA team and a D3 team? No wonder they have announced their intention of going FBS immediately.

can you imagine what they might draw to see a game like Sac v Weber? Sac v Montana State? Sac v Davis....damn, they'll sell out the Liberty Bowl for that one.

your remaining home games aren't very exciting, unless Portland proves to be for real. but, if you get some students out and they see 3 big wins, you might get them hooked.
 
first off, UNBELIEVABLE game. i seriously underestimated sac state. that 3rd quarter was like nothing i've ever seen; hard to believe if you didn't see it. really sucks only 23 people(17 cat fans) witnessed it. sac state is no longer the BSC bottomfeeder and your fans should realize this.

ps..APPARENTLY you guys CAN throw the ball!
 
I have always wondered if Sac St even had a marketing dept but apparently they do. I'd like that job of doing nothing which is apparent by the attendance at home games. The marketing dept must have come up with the bright idea of using your football ticket stub to go to the volleyball game for free Saturday night after the football game. That must have brought in a bunch of $$.
The 1:00 game time is ridiculous. It was so !@#$%^&* hot who wants to go to Hornet stadium at that time. I was there sweltering in the heat but I know why a lot of people don't go because of the game time.
The ideas of going after the students and the local high schools is a no-brainer! I went to Missoula last week and the student and fan support was unbelievable. You couldn't even talk to the person next to you while they were yelling! The loudest noise on the field Saturday was the band.
 
That’s a pretty bad attendance number. I agree, if the current folks in the marketing department (if it wasn’t cut due to budget issues) aren’t getting it done, changes need to happen.

And welcome to Sac Buzz DrMike! :)
 
Marketing! Come on people. You are talking about state beauracracy at its finest. There was a definitive reason the seal of the university was the seal of the state.

As I've said for many years, Sac State is like the DMV. You pay your small fee, get your sticker and then they see you next year for the renewal. After five years you get the title.

Stand in line and are served by robots who are there to collect a paycheck. If anybody had any passion in that department they wouldnt know what to do with it, probably be classified as a domestic terrorist for challenging the 'outta sight, outta mind' mentality.

How dare you want something that might actually promote and require the employees to work harder, they have furloughs to think about you know.

**edit, not meant to offend any persons working in the department, just my observations coming from the private business sector.
 
Dr. Mike

Thanks for your input and welcome to our board!


H.H.

What marketing person did you talk to? I find it hard to believe that the type of indifference to ideas you describe is the official policy of the administration or the AD. More likely some marketing flack that didn't want to be bothered "speaking for the AD " as justification to blow you off.
They are doing some minor promotions such youth football, which I normally see at our last home game.
I don't believe that the teams in their jerseys or their coaches pay full price (or maybe anything) to get into the game. I have also seen a lot of youth football teams at the Mountain Lion game and at the Stanford game they actually let the teams on the field at halftime to run some plays. I believe they are doing some promotions just not aggressively enough to make a difference. Those of us who support the program by buying tickets and/or by making contributions have a right to know what they are doing to improve the program and how our contributions are being used. I am going to write to Dr. Wanless and possibly Dr. Gonzalez if need be to ask for an explanation. I will share any reply.
 
I want to welcome Dr. Mike as well...he's one of the good guys over on the Aggie board, and used to kick our behinds back in the 80's when he played for Coach Sochor, if memory serves me correct.

He's not a troll, but a knowledgable poster who happened to make the unfortunate choice of attending the wrong university in his youth, a time when all of us have made mistakes, lol...although he partly made up for it by sending one of his kids to Sac.

He's always treated me with respect over there and I know we can extend the same courtesy!
 
Let me start off by saying, no more games before 6:00pm before late October! It is hot and miserable sitting on aluminum seating in 90+ degree weather. I imagine a fair amount of students, alumni and fans didn’t show up because of the uncomfortable conditions.

Marketing, marketing, marketing. IMO marketing is the main factor behind the lack of interest in Hornet sports. The department needs to start spending some cash on television, radio and billboard advertising. I’ve noticed the bus ads, but I don’t think a moving target gives the onlooker enough information to get interested.

What about buying airtime every so often on a local channel to have a Hornet Sports Show? Give the local community some insight into Hornet athletics. Show highlights and interview coaches and players. Lets not rely solely on students and alumni to show up, lets get the community invested in our athletic program.

I like the idea of offering discounted tickets to local high schools and organizations. Get them in a few games and hook the parents and kids. We are a good team now. We can bring them back.
 
Offer a PE class worth 3 credits and call it 'Community Responsibility'.

Every sporting event (football & BBall primary) must be attended, tests given on final results. Academic semester project could be to formulate a marketing plan for the department. Also, groups could be developed for community outreach (cold calling, marketing flyers, shopping mall exposure, etc.)

More academic alignment could be recognized by having students work a P&L budget sheet on how to manage a department. Isn't 3 hours of PE required to graduate, this is a perfect class to offer involvement and at the same time grow school spirit and long term involvement.

Since we don't obviously have money for marketing, why not use the resources we have alot of; students who need a PE class to graduate.
 
Phantom Hornet said:
I want to welcome Dr. Mike as well...he's one of the good guys over on the Aggie board, and used to kick our behinds back in the 80's when he played for Coach Sochor, if memory serves me correct.

He's not a troll, but a knowledgable poster who happened to make the unfortunate choice of attending the wrong university in his youth, a time when all of us have made mistakes, lol...although he partly made up for it by sending one of his kids to Sac.

He's always treated me with respect over there and I know we can extend the same courtesy!
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MAN...there's a left-handed compliment! not a troll..but...you screwed up your life when you were 18! ;)

Since we're all holding hands and singing Cumbaya, i won't post the Causeway scores my four years. :o

Seriously, Sac was really, really good for my oldest son! Just like Davis was really, really good for my youngest son.

If memory serves, my oldest had a freshman orientation class his first semester at Sac. One 'assignment' was to tailgate at a home game and attend as a group. Good idea, they all had a good time. it would be a better idea if they would follow it up with a 2nd one, and a 3rd one. one of the things i like most about Aggie games vs. my times is the student involvement. its pretty cool seeing them walk over in droves from the dorms, even better to watch and listen to them during the game. builds a great atmosphere for ALL those in attendence. that's the beauty of an on-campus stadium.

we had a debate this season about starting times at Davis. we have a 2:00 start on 10/23 -> parent's weekend (lots of events planned in the morning). that should be reasonable. the next two, including the Causeway, are at 4:00. that's a perfect time....no conflicts with youth sports, but, the out-of-towners (like me, driving back to LIvermore) can get home at a reasonable time.
 
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