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BIg Sky Tourney to Vegas?

webergrad02 said:
Sacalum - We have all had to book last minute trips for years and it isn't cheap from SLC either (mostly to Missoula). Our women rarely make they tournament so we only have to worry about it on one side.

Yes the unbalanced schedule does create some issues. But inviting all 12 schools may not be the answer. You cannot tell me that a 2 win SUU team deserved to play on this year. An empty arena in Vegas is not going to do crap to boost our conference.

Maybe the real problem is that we started letting crap teams that play in junior high gyms into the conference 15+ years ago. Sac would have a bigger budget if you had more than 600 fans at a game. You had the best game finish in all of mens basketball last year and it is a shame that the replays on national news had to show that poor excuse of a facility.

I am sorry but Montana and Weber have carried this conference for years in basketball. You would feel differently if you had the support of 7,000 fans at each home game. The current system on both the mens and womens side has done a decent job of sending the best team to the tournament.

With how bad SUU was, I don't think they would have won a game this year in a tournament, so why worry about that?

Yes we all know about our arena situation. Please remind us how bad it is? It's not like I don't notice the 15 times a year with my season tickets that we play in what should be a volleyball only facility. All I know is, the school is working on fundraising for it along with student fees. This year has seen an uptick in donations towards basketball with both programs having pretty successful seasons.

We actually have a large overall athletic budget, but that happens when we sponsor 21 sports. How many does Weber sponsor again?

As far as an empty arena, I can now finally attend the Big Sky Tournament, especially in Vegas now that its known ahead of time and I can book early and get really good rates and/or use my points. I also believe with a predetermined site where everyone knows in advance will actually build excitement throughout the year because all schools can promote the tourney on their websites and in the arena's/gym's all season long.

Im either for the Orleans Arena in LV or Reno Events Center. Both seat 5-8K and are the right sized venues. YMMV.
 
Maybe the real problem is that we started letting crap teams that play in junior high gyms into the conference 15+ years ago. Sac would have a bigger budget if you had more than 600 fans at a game. You had the best game finish in all of mens basketball last year and it is a shame that the replays on national news had to show that poor excuse of a facility.

I am sorry but Montana and Weber have carried this conference for years in basketball. You would feel differently if you had the support of 7,000 fans at each home game. The current system on both the mens and womens side has done a decent job of sending the best team to the tournament.[/quote]

Well, the real problem is that football drives everything in college athletics, and Nevada, Boise State and Idaho left the league 20 years ago because of football, and both Montana and Montana State came damn close to leaving a couple of years ago. So the conference, in an effort to build in some long-term membership stability, started adding schools like Sac State, UNC, PSU, SUU and UND. Oh, and Idaho came back in everything but football.

None of the schools in the BSC have top-quality basketball facilities other than Weber. None has built a new arena in the past 30 years. The league has never had an at-large team selected for the NCAA, and probably never will. In many years, the league has gone without a team in the NIT.

So bottom line is, the Big Sky is a bottom-feeder conference and that's not going to change anytime in the near future. Now Weber and Montana can complain about that and the fact that most of the other schools in the conference want a pre-determined site because, well, that will impact Montana and Weber the most. But it won't stop the rest of the conference presidents from doing what they think is in the best interest of their particular school. Whether that turns out to be a pre-determined site remains to be, well, determined.

Just for the record, I liked the set-up we had a couple of years ago, where first-round games were played on the campus of the higher seeded teams, and then the survivors all got together for the semis and finals at the top seed's place. I thought it gave more teams more to play for over a longer period. I understand that caused last-minute travel issues, too, and so I accepted the eight-team tourney at the top seed's place. I, like most Weber fans, wonder just what kind of attendance the tournament will draw in Vegas, or another "neutral site." If we're going to a pre-determined site, I'd rather see it somewhere that is already in the Big Sky footprint -- Billings, Salt Lake, Boise, Spokane, etc. I've been to Vegas a million times, and I have no interest going there to watch a Big Sky Conference basketball game.

But I realize the conference has struggled with this issue forever -- they've changed the format many times, had a pre-determined site for a few years, then went away from it, and now is considering going back. I sincerely doubt they will strike upon the "perfect solution" this time around, either, and I'm fully expecting this issue will be revisited in another five years, no matter what they decide this time around.
 
Vegas is definitely in the Big Sky footprint. You fly there to go to SUU if you are everyone but ISU, WSU and NAU. And it's close enough to Flagstaff.
 
Sac fans wanting the tourney in Reno is a laugher, not going to happen. Orleans is booked out, Southpoint is way off the beaten path, but is the most likely scenario. Also MVC is likely entering the mix of a Vegas conference tourney to add more competition for venue.

Conference fully acknowledges Webers carries this conference in hoops, and this whole thing is not being pushed by the conference, I talked to someone at the conference, and his quote was "we don't have a dog in this race" but the other 10 schools are pushing hard.

The problem I have is this, my interest & support dramatically reduces if we don't have a chance to host. Playing the ISU's & Sac's, of the world it's hard enough to stay engaged as Weber hoops is the only sport I even care about anymore, but I see that waning if this goes through.

So we are left with a conference tourney at the Southpoint of all places ( just so we can say we're in Vegas ) A total of 500-800 fans if we're lucky, and a Weber fan base who loses major interest in the regular season as a result. Yep sounds like the Big Suck is at it again. Why we're at it why don't we invite N. Dakota into the conference? I hear they are only 1,200 miles away from conference hq, & 1,700 miles away from Sac St., & then when they complain about their Hotel accommodations in Ogden during the tourney & hassle to get to Ogden let's move the conference tourney to the Southpoint. Who's excited?
 
WeberSki said:
Sac fans wanting the tourney in Reno is a laugher, not going to happen. Orleans is booked out, Southpoint is way off the beaten path, but is the most likely scenario. Also MVC is likely entering the mix of a Vegas conference tourney to add more competition for venue.

Conference fully acknowledges Webers carries this conference in hoops, and this whole thing is not being pushed by the conference, I talked to someone at the conference, and his quote was "we don't have a dog in this race" but the other 10 schools are pushing hard.

The problem I have is this, my interest & support dramatically reduces if we don't have a chance to host. Playing the ISU's & Sac's, of the world it's hard enough to stay engaged as Weber hoops is the only sport I even care about anymore, but I see that waning if this goes through.

I could give a care less where the pre-determined site is. Hell, PSU and us both have NBA arena's (and we have a new one coming in 2 years) in addition to Weber having the Delta Center (can't remember its new name) for all intents and purposes. UNC has the Pepsi Center too. I just want to be able to go without it being the last minute of A) getting into the tourney and B) if I even have the coinage to fly. Besides, I can put in for vacation time with a pre-determined site. I can't do that now. Too many variables/unknowns.
 
Dang that North Dakota women's team for winning the league and hosting! Getting teams to Grand Forks was an issue this year. That was the kerosene for when the newest conference members came in and lit the match. Then there was a certain bald coach with a shiny head that lost the tie breaker and didn't get to go to the tournament. I bet he is one of them that is fanning the flames.

The Orleans is not an option as least as long as the WAC survives. The Southpoint is probably the place. I just stayed their in April and it is a decent facility, but it is going to be empty. Vegas isn't a Big Sky town. It is going to be hard to get sponsors like Red Lion to stay on. How many Vegas sponsors will we be able to get? In three days the fans and their money are gone. If the venue loses money for a few years they will cut ties and we will be back to the drawing board anyways.

Billings as a possible location. That's a joke right? I would rather have the tournament in Doug Fullerton's backyard on the East bench. The Big Sky really does have a dog in the fight. They have to say that but they benefit when the tournament is in Ogden.
 
webergrad02 said:
Dang that North Dakota women's team for winning the league and hosting! Getting teams to Grand Forks was an issue this year. That was the kerosene for when the newest conference members came in and lit the match. Then there was a certain bald coach with a shiny head that lost the tie breaker and didn't get to go to the tournament. I bet he is one of them that is fanning the flames.

The Orleans is not an option as least as long as the WAC survives. The Southpoint is probably the place. I just stayed their in April and it is a decent facility, but it is going to be empty. Vegas isn't a Big Sky town. It is going to be hard to get sponsors like Red Lion to stay on. How many Vegas sponsors will we be able to get? In three days the fans and their money are gone. If the venue loses money for a few years they will cut ties and we will be back to the drawing board anyways.

Billings as a possible location. That's a joke right? I would rather have the tournament in Doug Fullerton's backyard on the East bench. The Big Sky really does have a dog in the fight. They have to say that but they benefit when the tournament is in Ogden.

So Weber is going to lose Red Lion as a general sponsor because of moving the tourney to Vegas? I don't buy that. You guys don't even host the BSCT every year anyways. And if that's the sole reason why Red Lion sponsors Weber on the off shoot chance they host the men's tourney then they aren't really the supporting sponsor you want to have long term.
 
Red Lion is not our sponsor it is the Big Skys sponsor. They were the major sponsor for the Big Sky tournament even though there is no Red Lion in Ogden. The closest Red Lion is in Salt Lake.
 
webergrad02 said:
Red Lion is not our sponsor it is the Big Skys sponsor. The closest Red Lion is in Salt Lake.

You do realize the two tournaments Montana hosted the conference did not have Red Lion as a sponsor. In fact there was no sponsor at all.
 
I get it...it is expensive for fans and programs to travel at such a late notice. Getting time off of work is bugger, but lets look at the real issue. Who cares if opposing team fans can make it or not? If they can, great, come on over to wherever the tournament is being played and enjoy three days of basketball. If not...well, YOUR TEAM DIDN'T WIN the right to host. The regular season winner should have those advantages. Being able to stay in their beds, being in their city, and having a sold out arena with a very partisan and supportive crowd.

Empty stadiums in Vegas isn't the answer.

Final thought...if you aren't one of the top 7 teams in the conference then your season is over. The regular season should represent something. The Sky is not the PAC-12. We only get 1 team into the Dance. That team should be the team that wins it all in the regular season. If We HAVE to have a conference tournament, then it should favor that regular season winner. HELL, a couple years ago, the conference wanted to help UNCO sooo badly that even the refs helped them beat UM in the championship game. UNCO was after all the regular season winner. They deserved to host and go to the Dance. If they play in Vegas...they lose in front of 200 fans.

Sac fans are use to 200 fans watching a game and aren't embarrassed by empty stadiums on ESPN. Weber fans...not so much.
 
SactoHornetAlum said:
webergrad02 said:
Red Lion is not our sponsor it is the Big Skys sponsor. The closest Red Lion is in Salt Lake.

You do realize the two tournaments Montana hosted the conference did not have Red Lion as a sponsor. In fact there was no sponsor at all.

First Montana Bank...I believe was a sponsor two years ago.
 
I don’t understand what the big fuss is about. The BSC will do what is best for the bottom line. If Vegas/Reno is going to subsidize travel/costs associated with the BSCT then the decision is a “no brainer”. I think the “success” of the Vegas location will be on par with what the WAC saw at their tournament there this past year. It’s really up to the BSC power that be to decide if trying this out is worth it.

I do hate the idea of everyone getting a BSCT bid. Why even have a regular season at that point.

Another idea the BSC needs to look into is rotating among city’s within the BSC footprint that have a viable venue to host the BSCT. That way you get it close to certain fan bases on any given year and the other teams/fans can still make travel plans well in advance.
SLC, Denver, Sac (new NBA arena in 2 years), Portland, Spokane, Vegas/Reno ( potential subsidy), Phoenix (ok maybe not Phoenix). All of those cities have venue’s that would suffice. Maybe see which cities have the best turnout/support and narrow the rotation down to 2-4 of those on the list over time.

PS: good to see some of the WSU contingent sticking to their classy ways. :lol:
 
webergrad02 said:
Dang that North Dakota women's team for winning the league and hosting! Getting teams to Grand Forks was an issue this year. That was the kerosene for when the newest conference members came in and lit the match. Then there was a certain bald coach with a shiny head that lost the tie breaker and didn't get to go to the tournament. I bet he is one of them that is fanning the flames.

The Orleans is not an option as least as long as the WAC survives. The Southpoint is probably the place. I just stayed their in April and it is a decent facility, but it is going to be empty. Vegas isn't a Big Sky town. It is going to be hard to get sponsors like Red Lion to stay on. How many Vegas sponsors will we be able to get? In three days the fans and their money are gone. If the venue loses money for a few years they will cut ties and we will be back to the drawing board anyways.

Billings as a possible location. That's a joke right? I would rather have the tournament in Doug Fullerton's backyard on the East bench. The Big Sky really does have a dog in the fight. They have to say that but they benefit when the tournament is in Ogden.
The WAC is apparently not thrilled with Vegas either. A Phoenix TV station reported the WAC's Ads are split 4-4 over moving their tourney to Phoenix over lousy attendance in Vegas. Let the debate continue...
 
SDHornet said:
I don’t understand what the big fuss is about. The BSC will do what is best for the bottom line. If Vegas/Reno is going to subsidize travel/costs associated with the BSCT then the decision is a “no brainer”. I think the “success” of the Vegas location will be on par with what the WAC saw at their tournament there this past year. It’s really up to the BSC power that be to decide if trying this out is worth it.

I do hate the idea of everyone getting a BSCT bid. Why even have a regular season at that point.

Another idea the BSC needs to look into is rotating among city’s within the BSC footprint that have a viable venue to host the BSCT. That way you get it close to certain fan bases on any given year and the other teams/fans can still make travel plans well in advance.
SLC, Denver, Sac (new NBA arena in 2 years), Portland, Spokane, Vegas/Reno ( potential subsidy), Phoenix (ok maybe not Phoenix). All of those cities have venue’s that would suffice. Maybe see which cities have the best turnout/support and narrow the rotation down to 2-4 of those on the list over time.

PS: good to see some of the WSU contingent sticking to their classy ways. :lol:

If there has to be a pre-determined site, rotating it among the top Big Sky stadiums/cities would be better than just doing it in Vegas.

By the way...did you watch the WAC Championship? It was a pretty pathetic scene thar in Vegas.

Class?? Well, at least this isn't EGRIZ!! :nod:
 
I was at last years touney at the Dee and stayed in the same hotel as the UNC team. Even though Greeley is only 51 miles from Denver Intl Airport, the UNC team had to ride a bus 480 miles and 8 hours to get to your centrally located site. I believe if Weber ever had to ride a bus to UNC you may have a different outlook on this situation.
 
talhadfoursteals said:
If there has to be a pre-determined site, rotating it among the top Big Sky stadiums/cities would be better than just doing it in Vegas.

By the way...did you watch the WAC Championship? It was a pretty pathetic scene thar in Vegas.

Class?? Well, at least this isn't EGRIZ!! :nod:
Yup. That is what the BSC should expect. If the BSC can live with that and/or it is still financially viable then they may decide it is worth it.
 
sacstateman said:
I was at last years touney at the Dee and stayed in the same hotel as the UNC team. Even though Greeley is only 51 miles from Denver Intl Airport, the UNC team had to ride a bus 480 miles and 8 hours to get to your centrally located site. I believe if Weber ever had to ride a bus to UNC you may have a different outlook on this situation.
My guess is they didn't want to "splurge" on air fare. I saw on the ISU board that the ISU women bused it all the way to Grand Forks for the women's BSCT last year. :o :ohno:

Being too poor to build nice facilities is one thing, but being too poor to not fly your athlete's to competition is another. WAFJ.
 
Well...maybe UNCO should play better so that they could have the right to host, and not have to ride a bus 480miles. I feel sooo bad for the Cubbies. Poor little bears.

Weber Athletes ride buses all the times. Actual, for football one season, Weber had to bus to Wyoming, Colorado State and Northern Colorado in the same season. Hell in the same month. It is called being a college athlete.
 
SDHornet said:
talhadfoursteals said:
If there has to be a pre-determined site, rotating it among the top Big Sky stadiums/cities would be better than just doing it in Vegas.

By the way...did you watch the WAC Championship? It was a pretty pathetic scene thar in Vegas.

Class?? Well, at least this isn't EGRIZ!! :nod:
Yup. That is what the BSC should expect. If the BSC can live with that and/or it is still financially viable then they may decide it is worth it.

I see your point SD...I get it, the Sky wants to make or save more $$$ for the conference and its partners (teams), but at what cost? The BSC shouldn't be willing and fine with trading possible/relative financial viability for empty stadiums and embarrassing nationally broadcast games. The Sky should be doing more to enhance its product.
 
talhadfoursteals said:
Well...maybe UNCO should play better so that they could have the right to host, and not have to ride a bus 480miles. I feel sooo bad for the Cubbies. Poor little bears.

Weber Athletes ride buses all the times. Actual, for football one season, Weber had to bus to Wyoming, Colorado State and Northern Colorado in the same season. Hell in the same month. It is called being a college athlete.
Busing within reason is understandable, busing because the department is too cheap/too poor is another issue.
 

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