Did you see anything that made you think this team will improve within two years? I'm an alum who survived Downings two 1-10 seasons. I was living out of state when Collins played, so I didn't know who he was when he took over.....and I'll admit I fell for the Hawkins-esque talk from the staff since they showed up, and I was prepared to give them a bit of a honeymoon. Not anymore. These guys better get this thing going and PDQ.
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Is Collins the right coach?
- Thread starter Beardown
- Start date
gobears2010
Active member
hoel4800 said:
Oooh, you lived through two of the Downing years, good for you. :thumb:
I'm also an alum, and I've been through all of the Downing years, all of the Dalton years and most of the Glenn years. I saw half this coaching staff play for the Bears. I've forgotten more about UNC football than you'll ever know.
I did see some positives today, namely 1.) the wrong QB started, and I'm pretty sure the coaching staff realized it and 2.) a couple very talented freshmen on the D-line, Devontae Chapple and Lexington Smith, those guys looked like real playmakers now and for the future. I also think the team, coaches and players, made the rookie mistake of severely underestimating Lindenwood, and paid for it.
When you have QB issues and aren't ready for a team, you're liable to lose to someone you shouldn't. I remember in 1997, when UNC was defending it's national title, the Bears went up to Western State with Dean Grable at QB...and lost. By the end of the season, Corte McGuffey was our QB and we won the national title game 51-0.
Coaching is like anything else, you have to learn to do it. We let Downing not figure it out for five years, let's not send Collins up the river after one game.
Blofeld
Active member
It's too early to say, the guy has to be able to recruit his type of players (we all know the Downing guys are soft) but that team today was so timid, it looked like Lindlewood was the FCS team and we were NAIA. No swagger, very soft, no confidence... very disappointing... either Downing recruited a shit load of pussies or this staff did not prepare this team to win...
Unfortunately we can't change coaches every year so good or bad we're stuck with this guy for at least 5 years.
If it's 5 years of what I saw today I'll be turning my diploma in sometime around 2013 and expunging my degree from my resume, I'll just go with being a high school grad.
Unfortunately we can't change coaches every year so good or bad we're stuck with this guy for at least 5 years.
If it's 5 years of what I saw today I'll be turning my diploma in sometime around 2013 and expunging my degree from my resume, I'll just go with being a high school grad.
GoBears---
I don't think Lobato greatly helped the cause today, but I didn't see anything that in my mind that said bench him if he's not healthy. I agree with you on the d linemen you referenced---looking forward to watching those two develop. Regardless of any positives we can pick out, this is a VERY BAD LOSS. My point with my original post was this: With a loss as bad as this one was, the honeymoon for Collins (think Jon Embree, or even John Fox---signs that these teams are going in the right direction) is now over.
I don't think Lobato greatly helped the cause today, but I didn't see anything that in my mind that said bench him if he's not healthy. I agree with you on the d linemen you referenced---looking forward to watching those two develop. Regardless of any positives we can pick out, this is a VERY BAD LOSS. My point with my original post was this: With a loss as bad as this one was, the honeymoon for Collins (think Jon Embree, or even John Fox---signs that these teams are going in the right direction) is now over.
gobears2010
Active member
hoel4800 said:
I know what the point of your post was. The point of mine is that you can't give up on a guy after one game, even a terrible one like this. Every team has bad games, we have to see where Collins and the team go from this before we make any determinations.
(Also, Jon Embree? The only signs that team showed tonight are signs that they're the worst team in the Pac-12.)
Bearsfan24
Active member
gobears2010 said:
I agree. We can't give up on the coaching staff just yet. But you have to understand that a lot frustration is still being held over from the Downing debacle. Coach Collins came in like a fireball, and with a ton of confidence, which I like and I think you need. After seeing yesterday, a lot of us can't help but think if this is the same old song and dance. I think Coach Collins and his staff came in too confident, and they got knocked back down to reality yesterday. I just hope they learn from their mistakes made before and during the game.
As much as I was ready to give up on the team after yesterday for another year, it is just ridiculous to judge Collins and this team just yet. I keep thinking about Tad Boyle's first year here when they won like 4 games and lost to UCCS--a loss equally as humiliating as the Lindelwood loss. Boyle's first year here looked like more of the same we had always seen and there was not even a hint that he would turn the team around.
beardevil39
Active member
gobears2010 said:
I also remember losing to Western State and then going on to winning the NationalChampionship I remember the years before Joe Glenn but really remember the program turning around when we beat North Dakota State at old Jackson Field in Glenn's early days. One game does not decide Collins fate and honestly I was more impressed with Lindonwoods size and speed than our shortcomings. I think they are as good as any Big Sky team we have seen!! I still say this guy is headed in the right direction!! Go Bears
bearcrawls
Active member
Blofeld said:
How can we recruit difference makers after a 3 win season last year and what appears to be a 2-3 win season this year? We need to look at signing JC players with experience, build the team to a 6-7-8 win team, then we can try to recruit better players from high school. And lastly, we need to stop recruiting so much in state, get out there and recruit from states who produce football players like Florida, Texas and California.
I think we all need to take a collective breath here. Should the University of Northern Colorado lose to Lindenwood? No. But to turn a program around takes time. The unfortunate lesson we can take out of yesterday's ball game is that it might be a little bit more work to turn it around than we had previously hoped/imagined. When you're trying to run a spread, fastbreak offense you need to find your type of players who suit that style of play. Now, that's not to say these current players aren't capable, because they are. For all the tough shortcomings this program had under the tenure of Downing, he could RECRUIT. There are talented players within this program right now, but they are going to have to change just about everything they have learned in jumping from one system to another.
Talentwise, Coach Collins and his staff aren't walking into a bare cupboard. But on a mental-level, they are. One of the toughest things for a new coaching staff to come into for a program that has been struggling for awhile is changing the culture. This goes beyond X's and O's. None of these players know what it's like to play on a winning team at this level. Their confidence-levels aren't high right now. "Swagger" is an integral part for any football program to have success, you have to walk into a stadium every Saturday KNOWING that you will win, not just thinking it. That culture change is occurring right now.
This past Saturday was supposed to be Day One in the resurrection of this football program, unfortunately that day got delayed a little bit. But it is coming in the very near future. I truly believe we will see a rapidly improving ballclub from week-to-week. And while I know many of you want to jump off the proverbial ledge after this game; just take a step back and realize that there IS something positive brewing here in Greeley. There will be highs and lows along the way, but you just gotta trust Coach Collins and staff. Don't expect to be in the doldrums too much longer people.... Why?
Because we're the University of Northern Colorado.
Talentwise, Coach Collins and his staff aren't walking into a bare cupboard. But on a mental-level, they are. One of the toughest things for a new coaching staff to come into for a program that has been struggling for awhile is changing the culture. This goes beyond X's and O's. None of these players know what it's like to play on a winning team at this level. Their confidence-levels aren't high right now. "Swagger" is an integral part for any football program to have success, you have to walk into a stadium every Saturday KNOWING that you will win, not just thinking it. That culture change is occurring right now.
This past Saturday was supposed to be Day One in the resurrection of this football program, unfortunately that day got delayed a little bit. But it is coming in the very near future. I truly believe we will see a rapidly improving ballclub from week-to-week. And while I know many of you want to jump off the proverbial ledge after this game; just take a step back and realize that there IS something positive brewing here in Greeley. There will be highs and lows along the way, but you just gotta trust Coach Collins and staff. Don't expect to be in the doldrums too much longer people.... Why?
Because we're the University of Northern Colorado.
BigBlueBear
Member
I hate to say it Collins is a great coach alot more inspired to win than Downing was, but he has more to lose as well. Collins may not have the best coaches around him to be successful ,Downin had Peterson and Deti. Collins has ???? Collins may have been picked for the job be use if his alumni status as well as being a cheap buy. We wanted Dave Logan but his deal with the Broncos and Mullen are better fits for him. Collins has to rebuild after losing too much telnet if this is last year and Collins loses to Adams ok big problem. Let's be honest our O-Line is experinced yet awful .Besides Shapior and Barbiaz take your pick to run through any gap. Our offense doesn't have a set Qb. And we have no run game.Sorry but Deans can not be your starter opening day loved his success story but can't be your starter. Wide out play has gone down since 2009 Thompson,walker,Davis in 2009 were great , play calling was just too predictable. The Loss of your biggest gun really hurts Davis being ineligible blows for Collins. Walker needs a stud wideout to be at his best which is one on one coverage beating people with short passes and big yards after the catch. I look at the defense and there are too many holes to fill. Lbs are very average Friend might be a player if he learned how to tackle. Herron is no longer a starter ? Really Coach ?! Chappel over Herron dumb dumb dumb. The DB's are just sad take your pick who do you want to rack up stars against Riggins or Owens . Who in the hell voted Owens all conference? He got beat for like 1,000 yds last year 170 in the Weber State Game last year in the fist half all I could remember is saying who hell is that number 9 getting beat every time a pass gets thrown. Dorsey may play himself to an second team all conference bid. Gibbons looks to be productive but still lacks mental stability seen him blow way too many converges last year example game on the line in the Montana State game he blows coverage twice for touchdowns to help Montana state win their first big sky title. If he can over come mental bust he might be a solid player, Given he has the physical abilities but yet looks uncordinated. So let's not drill the hammer on Collins yet he's has alot to over come and he's only good at his first recruiting class so when they are juniors let's judge. But I feel like Downing knew he was out, recruited some players I'm just puzzled about???? But Collins simply doesn't have the talent , and the coach is only as good as the product he puts on the field and right now we are honestly the 8th best team in our conference from a athletic stand point
ItsaBearsThang said:
Collins has to back up his talk. He deserves to be blasted on here for running his mouth about how "We're not rebuilding" and then following that up with a loss to NAIA opponent and a 30 point loss to the one conference opponent we've had our way with. I thought I saw a "rapidly improving" team in the 2nd half against CSU, but this was a HUGE step backwards to say the least. One other thing---Too often with coaching changes you see a guy come in and try to fix things that don't need fixing and in the process create an even bigger problem for themselves. We had a talented QB in Dylan Orms, but Collins wanted to start his guy in Lobato.
Bearsfan24
Active member
I think there's a few things that happen before the season that doomed this football team, well I shouldn't say doomed, but effected. Number one, the loss of Jace Davis, this is a bigger blow than I previously thought. I didn't think it would effect the wide receiver core that much, but it has, he's that big play threat/play maker this teams needs. Second, the decision to start Lobato, I'm not saying he can't get the job done but he just isn't ready right now. Orms is the veteran, has game experience, and knows how to lead the team. Yes, I know he's had his moments, but I think not naming him the start effected psyche of this team. Lastly, I think Collins is good hire, he just didn't surround himself with good coaches. The defense has been absolutely lit up, and offense has done jack.
As a coach, you're only as good as the people you surround yourself with. If Dan Hawkins had brought Chris Peterson to CU with him, he'd still be coaching there I'd bet. Being able to keep a guy like Brent Venables at Oklahoma is a key reason why they're a factor every year. In an example closer to home, look at EWU with Paul Wulff/Beau Baldwin.
hno:
