Utah State

[SWWeatherCat]

Anyone who presses or plays a zone on Weber will always have a shot. TOTAL collapse!!! :wall:

Everyone knows that already based on years of seeing the ineptness. Funny thing: on the Aggie pre-game show Stew was asked something to the effect of what Rahe (student) does or doesn't do that is pretty different from what Stew (teacher) does. Stew said Rahe doesn't play zone. He obviously knows NOTHING about zone period. Maybe Rahe should study up on using one since USU didn't even break a sweat working the paint.

 

[SWWeatherCat]

... Congrats to USU and its fans. Showed a lot of heart not packing it in after being down 18 and can't knock the superior adjustments made at the half! ...

... I was very impressed by Collette and couldn't even count the number of dunks he had because of his skill around the basket. He played a helluva game. ...

It was unreal that Weber was the team that packed it in at half. I'm not sold on the "superior adjustments" anyone even remotely familiar with Rahe knows you throw a zone and/press at him and there's a good chance they collapse. The first half Weber was hitting everything and the Aggs were literally throwing up crap. Collett was still waltzing to the rim in the first half. Weber was lost in the second half, absolutely lost because a 1-3-1 was in front of them and Rahe had NOTHING. Defensively, Weber was lost the entire game. They had no clue what to do with a pick-n-roll or give-n-go. They couldn't stay in front of anyone.....I don't know what I thought I saw defensively in the P-n-W scrimmage!

 

[SWWeatherCat]

Bolomboy is a beast, he needed more touches. His defense wasn't horrible last night either. He kept coming off Collete to help with drives and no one would adjust to cover Collete. ...

Bolomboy's D was not great either. You're right, Hill was the main culprit, he looked so timid and lost last night it was very discouraging. I can't single Hill out, defensively Weber was very poor, but Hill looked confused and just timid. USU had 2-3 guys keying on Bolomboy all night and Rahe couldn't take advantage.

 

[Wildcat_Fan]

It was unreal that Weber was the team that packed it in at half. I'm not sold on the "superior adjustments" anyone even remotely familiar with Rahe knows you throw a zone and/press at him and there's a good chance they collapse. The first half Weber was hitting everything and the Aggs were literally throwing up crap. Collett was still waltzing to the rim in the first half. Weber was lost in the second half, absolutely lost because a 1-3-1 was in front of them and Rahe had NOTHING. Defensively, Weber was lost the entire game. They had no clue what to do with a pick-n-roll or give-n-go. They couldn't stay in front of anyone.....I don't know what I thought I saw defensively in the P-n-W scrimmage!

Hit the nail on the head. Rahe had nothing. He was literally scratching his head and looking at his coaches after the 3rd turnover in a row! Players were lost, coaches were lost. We will ALWAYS be a big sky program until we can compete at a higher level. Im scared for what BYU is going to do to us at the Dee.

 

[Itiger]

We will be 1-1 after Monday night, but we have a lot of interesting games on the schedule. Important that we don't go 0 for D1 in OCC play!

 

[SWWeatherCat]

"It wasn't about shots. It was about our defense," said Weber State head coach Randy Rahe. :wtf:

It was about Utah State shooting horrible shots in the first half. It was about a Utah State 1-3-1 zone in the second half, to the tune of a 14 point half for Weber and their first basket coming about 16 minutes into the 2nd half. Can someone smarter than me explain what he saw that I didn't or what he's talking about? I agree the post D was horrific but even a meager 26 point 2nd half gets the win. It was as much about lack of shots and turnovers as anything from my perspective.

 

[3Wildcats]

I think you are right SW it was about USU's D not ours. That 3-2 or 1-3-1 or whatever they play destroyed our timing and took away our advantage. Stew saw his team could not guard any of our starters one on one and he knows how Randy struggles with zone D so great switch by Stew. Here is the problem I have last year our zone offense wasn't great either but we were able to break it when we needed to because of 2 things. 1 we had Berry who could get into the gaps off the dribble and either make the right pass, get to the rim, or get fouled sometimes both. 2nd we would pass the ball to our 4s at the free throw line so that would either open up the 5 or a kick out to 3 pt line for wide open 3s. Friday our guards where not strong enough to split the zone and few times they did they couldn't finish and definitely did not pass the ball. Our guards also refuse to pass the ball to weak spot in the zone which was the FT line where Hill would start. They would always call him out of that spot to set a pick so the could try and split the zone. Our coaching staff has to get them to understand where the soft spots are in the zone and get them to be willing to pass once they get the zone to collapse. That is what I saw.

 

[UtahPirate]

Ya, Ogden has made those lists too. I've lived in both and liked both. Logan is nice, but Ogden is better . Having said that, I hate Utah State. I actually was a USU fan before moving to Ogden, but after maturing quite a bit and seeing how in-state games and fans were across the whole state of Utah,I became more and more aware of the dooshiness of the USU student body. Was the halftime show really dedicated to sexual assault awareness???

Anyone who presses or plays a zone on Weber will always have a shot. TOTAL collapse!!! :wall:

Congratulations on your road to enlightenment! And I say that sincerely.

I have many in my family whose paths have taken them through Cache County and I still scratch my head at how that community tolerates the antics of their student body. Just a weird combination that makes up Aggie nation -- and not my kind of people at all. But I took my shots at their fans early in this thread.

First Half = Weber potential
Second Half = Weber youth

It will be fun to watch this team grow. I think Hunter will be a really great addition and may actually help us with the age old issue of breaking presses.

Experience will help with beating zones -- but practice against them better start this week!

 

[catscratched]

Hmmm. The old man (Stew) was more flexible in his defensive approach than the young man (Randy).

I wonder if that was an eye opener for Randy, or if he will conclude that we just need to play half court man defense a little harder? Likewise, do we just have to play our zone breaking offense better, or is a whole new approach indicated?

Rhetorical, I know, but it isn't a plan A if you don't have a plan B, or C. In the case of Ron A, Plans A through Z. To me, there is a problem with doing the same thing over and over, while expecting a better result each time. Practice does not make perfect, it makes permanent. :wall:

 

[WeberSki]

Hmmm. The old man (Stew) was more flexible in his defensive approach than the young man (Randy).

I wonder if that was an eye opener for Randy, or if he will conclude that we just need to play half court man defense a little harder? Likewise, do we just have to play our zone breaking offense better, or is a whole new approach indicated?

Rhetorical, I know, but it isn't a plan A if you don't have a plan B, or C. In the case of Ron A, Plans A through Z. To me, there is a problem with doing the same thing over and over, while expecting a better result each time. Practice does not make perfect, it makes permanent. :wall:

Why would it now be an eye opener? Did you not witness the Big Sky Tourney Championship game against Montana and Anthony Johnson. Up by 20 @ half.

Randy says over and over he is a creature of habit. I cringe every time I hear that.

 

[Da Bears]

Rahe is accountable, but he had some assistants who have to be more involved in on court adjustments. Duft, the new coach Smiley and Lever. They have to bring something to the table. Yes, it was a total collapse, but what scared me was that we never adjusted. We are going to see a zone variation the remainder of the season. Someone needs to google how to beat a zone!

Also feel we rely heavily on physical ability, we also need basketball IQ on the court! Hill and Bolomboy are still learning basketball. I thought they got exposed for relying more on their superior physical skills and less on basketball knowledge. How many times do you have to get beat on the pick and roll before you figure out how to defend it?

I thought Stew showed he's the master and Rahe isn't ready yet to snatch the pebble.

 

[AlumniWSU]

Rahe is accountable, but he had some assistants who have to be more involved in on court adjustments. Duft, the new coach Smiley and Lever. They have to bring something to the table. Yes, it was a total collapse, but what scared me was that we never adjusted. We are going to see a zone variation the remainder of the season. Someone needs to google how to beat a zone!

My thoughts exactly...I've noticed Dave Rose's & Stew's assistants always taking an active roll talking in turn to the players during timeouts, etc.

Hmmm. The old man (Stew) was more flexible in his defensive approach than the young man (Randy).{/quote}

Why would it now be an eye opener? Did you not witness the Big Sky Tourney Championship game against Montana and Anthony Johnson. Up by 20 @ half.

Randy says over and over he is a creature of habit. I cringe every time I hear that.

:nod: post I can agree on (by the way, your other post not deleted, just moved to 'other--smack talk' if you are crying censorship hno: )

 

[n.ogdencat]

Here I am, Monday Morning, and I'm still angry over the game. PLAY A DAMN ZONE sometimes. Okay, now that I got that out of my system. USU traveled to Illinois State and beat the Red Birds by 5 yesterday. So far the Aggies, and Stew, are proving to be better than expected. I don't think it has anything to do with guard play, but it has everything to do with the USU Bigs. Stew's system does not work unless he has bigs and specifically, he needs two bigs to really run it and, well, he's got them. We do to, just I don't think we have a coach who knows how to develop bigs. In Rahe's version of the "system" guard play is far more important, with a decent big who can score when needed. I don't think we have that. We need a 5 who can score.

 

[Da Bears]

Here I am, Monday Morning, and I'm still angry over the game. PLAY A DAMN ZONE sometimes. Okay, now that I got that out of my system. USU traveled to Illinois State and beat the Red Birds by 5 yesterday. So far the Aggies, and Stew, are proving to be better than expected. I don't think it has anything to do with guard play, but it has everything to do with the USU Bigs. Stew's system does not work unless he has bigs and specifically, he needs two bigs to really run it and, well, he's got them. We do to, just I don't think we have a coach who knows how to develop bigs. In Rahe's version of the "system" guard play is far more important, with a decent big who can score when needed. I don't think we have that. We need a 5 who can score.

Agree 100%........ Trez could play with his back to the basket. He was a classic 5! Colette is a classic 5 that had so many post moves and played the pick and roll to perfection. Joel is a great athlete and he's a 4 that playing the 5 position.

 

[Webergrad02]

Braxton I think is the player on our roster that has the best potential to play back to the basket.

 

[n.ogdencat]

Here I am, Monday Morning, and I'm still angry over the game. PLAY A DAMN ZONE sometimes. Okay, now that I got that out of my system. USU traveled to Illinois State and beat the Red Birds by 5 yesterday. So far the Aggies, and Stew, are proving to be better than expected. I don't think it has anything to do with guard play, but it has everything to do with the USU Bigs. Stew's system does not work unless he has bigs and specifically, he needs two bigs to really run it and, well, he's got them. We do to, just I don't think we have a coach who knows how to develop bigs. In Rahe's version of the "system" guard play is far more important, with a decent big who can score when needed. I don't think we have that. We need a 5 who can score.

Agree 100%........ Trez could play with his back to the basket. He was a classic 5! Colette is a classic 5 that had so many post moves and played the pick and roll to perfection. Joel is a great athlete and he's a 4 that playing the 5 position.

You could totally tell that Bolomboy was lost. Defensively he was totally exposed. He didn't know how to roll off and guard the big coming off the pick and roll. Collette ate him alive. He also looked really slow compared to Collette. We made him and Moore look like all-stars on the court on Friday. No matter, Weber needs a traditional 5. Hajek isn't the answer. I have hoped that he would be able to step into the role Tres left, but it isn't looking like that is going to be a possibility. He just doesn't look comfortable on the court. I think Braxton is the only guy on our roster who has the ability to play with his back towards the basket. Maybe Hill? Post him up when he is playing the 3? Coston doesn't seem like he can hang onto the ball. He needs some glue on his hands. :-D

 

[WSUfan4ever]

Rahe is accountable, but he had some assistants who have to be more involved in on court adjustments. Duft, the new coach Smiley and Lever. They have to bring something to the table. Yes, it was a total collapse, but what scared me was that we never adjusted. We are going to see a zone variation the remainder of the season. Someone needs to google how to beat a zone!

Also feel we rely heavily on physical ability, we also need basketball IQ on the court! Hill and Bolomboy are still learning basketball. I thought they got exposed for relying more on their superior physical skills and less on basketball knowledge. How many times do you have to get beat on the pick and roll before you figure out how to defend it?

I thought Stew showed he's the master and Rahe isn't ready yet to snatch the pebble.

I thought this was very true about basketball IQ. I truly can't imagine that the team does not work on playing against a zone. My thoughts while watching the game was that the players simply did not execute. A 1-3-1 zone is not the most common defense in D1, but mostly because it is fairly easy to break. The short corners and baseline 3 were open the entire 2nd half but for various reasons we could never take advantage.

In fairness to Rahe and his staff there are only so many hours of practice to this point in the season to work on every scenario that they will see. Combine that with the fact that the team has so much youth and very little combined D1 experience (JC transfers included).

The most disappointing thing to me was the interior defense ... way too soft. Are Bolomboy, Hill, and Hayek concerned about fouling because of our lack of depth, or is this a trend that we will see all season? Weak side rotations were a serious problem as well. Take away 11 uncontested dunks by Collette and we still win by 10. He did not even shoot one free throw!!!!

 

[WSUfan4ever]

Here I am, Monday Morning, and I'm still angry over the game. PLAY A DAMN ZONE sometimes. Okay, now that I got that out of my system. USU traveled to Illinois State and beat the Red Birds by 5 yesterday. So far the Aggies, and Stew, are proving to be better than expected. I don't think it has anything to do with guard play, but it has everything to do with the USU Bigs. Stew's system does not work unless he has bigs and specifically, he needs two bigs to really run it and, well, he's got them. We do to, just I don't think we have a coach who knows how to develop bigs. In Rahe's version of the "system" guard play is far more important, with a decent big who can score when needed. I don't think we have that. We need a 5 who can score.

Agree 100%........ Trez could play with his back to the basket. He was a classic 5! Colette is a classic 5 that had so many post moves and played the pick and roll to perfection. Joel is a great athlete and he's a 4 that playing the 5 position.

You could totally tell that Bolomboy was lost. Defensively he was totally exposed. He didn't know how to roll off and guard the big coming off the pick and roll. Collette ate him alive. He also looked really slow compared to Collette. We made him and Moore look like all-stars on the court on Friday. No matter, Weber needs a traditional 5. Hajek isn't the answer. I have hoped that he would be able to step into the role Tres left, but it isn't looking like that is going to be a possibility. He just doesn't look comfortable on the court. I think Braxton is the only guy on our roster who has the ability to play with his back towards the basket. Maybe Hill? Post him up when he is playing the 3? Coston doesn't seem like he can hang onto the ball. He needs some glue on his hands. :-D

At the 5 position if Joel cannot get on top of the basket he is lost. Stew did a good job of keeping him more than 5 feet from the basket when he caught the ball, and from a double team he struggled to get rid of the ball. However, I believe that he will improve. Hayek's best role for us is off the bench for energy and as an enforcer down low (which he has not shown at all so far). And Coston's size is clearly an issue. He got swatted at least once inside. I can only see him playing the 4 in limited situations, and never the 5.

 

[Da Bears]

Olds? Is Braxton officially redshirted or did he just not play?

 

[PURPLEFORLIFE]

Randy needs to get Phil on speed dial when Joel starts playing soft. Beckner would have ripped Joel a new one for his lazy and soft defense on Friday. He was timid and playing like he was better than what he really is. Beckner had a talent of humbling Joel.

Looks like he is a guy who needs a dose of reality every season before he gets it. Look at last year. He played terribly until the end of December and then started to really improve. Don't get me wrong. Joel is one of my favorite players, but for 20mins on Friday, he definitely wasn't. I'm glad I wasn't at that game. I heard from a couple of friends how miserable it was leaving the game. I heard that most USU fans were pretty nice. They must have been in abject shock.