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Coaching NEWS

While I don’t believe it will actually happen, count me in for a Troy Taylor homecoming.

He never should have left, especially to coach the rival of his alma mater.
 
I am sure he signed a 5yr agreement. If he was fired early, Stanford would be on the hook for two years of his salary. In many clauses for HC’s, Stanford would not be held responsible for those two years of salary if TT took another job. Think he would take a two year sabbatical and then bounce back as an OC somewhere, not here.

If he isn’t under a 5yr agreement, then I’m game with him coming back.
 
SDHornet said:
Yawn. I'm sure you can go to any fan twitter accounts for every team that lost this weekend and find people clamoring for a coach's head.
Click to expand...

Yawn is 3-9 and subpar coaching.

For 3 seasons we saw what top level FCS coaching, leadership, and recruiting looked like and the results that followed.

What’s happening now isn’t it.

Most of all, stop referencing last season and the opening round playoff win. You’ve seen and experienced enough to understand the history of 1st year coaches succeeding in the short term and in the wake of what was created and built-up before them.

Season 2 is telling a lot more of the truth. Typically it’d take 3 or 4 seasons to really see this level of decline. The fact that it has happened so quickly after season 1 should be a serious red flag to ALL.
 
This is a contract year for Andy, I don't think he's going anywhere. He'll have to make the choice as to whether he plans to go out on his shield with the guys he has, or make drastic changes to turn things around and earn an extension. Patience will be very thin for Orr and Wood.

Only chance they fire him is if TT is fired first and expresses an immediate desire to return to Sac State.
 
BuckeyeHornetFan said:
Yawn is 3-9 and subpar coaching.

For 3 seasons we saw what top level FCS coaching, leadership, and recruiting looked like and the results that followed.

What’s happening now isn’t it.

Most of all, stop referencing last season and the opening round playoff win. You’ve seen and experienced enough to understand the history of 1st year coaches succeeding in the short term and in the wake of what was created and built-up before them.

Season 2 is telling a lot more of the truth. Typically it’d take 3 or 4 seasons to really see this level of decline. The fact that it has happened so quickly after season 1 should be a serious red flag to ALL.
Click to expand...
"LeTs IgNoRe ThE sUcCeSs AnDy AnD tHiS sTaFf HaD bEcAuSe It DoEsNt FiT mY nArRaTiVe!"

First off, the '23 playoff win is meaningful as it proved all the doomers and detractors wrong both in our fanbase and for those claiming we didn't belong in the postseason. The road playoff win put that argument to bed for good. Why anyone, let alone Hornet fans, would want to discount our 2nd playoff win in D1 history to advocate for a coaching change is quite egregious.

Secondly, who from that '23 season quit that had a big impact on this season? What other roster changes/losses had on the field impacts? Sorry, your efforts to frame the narrative by viewing it from a vacuum from 2+ years ago by ignoring all the changes (both foreseen and unforeseen) makes the whole "coaching change" argument unpalatable.

We'll see what Coach Thompson does with this staff, if anything, but keeping Conklin here is the priority.
 
HeavyistheClown said:
I am sure he signed a 5yr agreement. If he was fired early, Stanford would be on the hook for two years of his salary. In many clauses for HC’s, Stanford would not be held responsible for those two years of salary if TT took another job. Think he would take a two year sabbatical and then bounce back as an OC somewhere, not here.

If he isn’t under a 5yr agreement, then I’m game with him coming back.
Click to expand...
Every contract is different. Fight fired him he would get paid out.
Happens all of the time!!!
 
SDHornet said:
"LeTs IgNoRe ThE sUcCeSs AnDy AnD tHiS sTaFf HaD bEcAuSe It DoEsNt FiT mY nArRaTiVe!"

First off, the '23 playoff win is meaningful as it proved all the doomers and detractors wrong both in our fanbase and for those claiming we didn't belong in the postseason. The road playoff win put that argument to bed for good. Why anyone, let alone Hornet fans, would want to discount our 2nd playoff win in D1 history to advocate for a coaching change is quite egregious.

Secondly, who from that '23 season quit that had a big impact on this season? What other roster changes/losses had on the field impacts? Sorry, your efforts to frame the narrative by viewing it from a vacuum from 2+ years ago by ignoring all the changes (both foreseen and unforeseen) makes the whole "coaching change" argument unpalatable.

We'll see what Coach Thompson does with this staff, if anything, but keeping Conklin here is the priority.
Click to expand...
I love Conklin… but I’d rather have a winning program with new coaching staff. Doubt Conklin would be happy if he had another season at .500 or less…
 
SDHornet said:
"LeTs IgNoRe ThE sUcCeSs AnDy AnD tHiS sTaFf HaD bEcAuSe It DoEsNt FiT mY nArRaTiVe!"
Click to expand...

To quote John McEnroe, "You can't be serious. You CANNOT be serious".

In all seriousness, I almost don't even know what to say to you in response. You're just being ignorant and argumentative at this point.

What success has Andy Thompson ever had as a head coach aside from what I already clearly outlined as a ONE season byproduct of the program Troy Taylor built?

The guy spent well over a decade as a coordinator and never a HC for a reason. He wasn't capable of building what Troy Taylor built. And already in season 2, he's proving he can't even maintain it beyond ONE freaking season.

Are you kidding me with this $#1t?

You talk about "ignoring" that which doesn't support a narrative -- you're the King of it right now (regarding this topic). All you've done and are continuing to do is ignore not only what has transpired this season, but that which I and a few others here have been outlining for you.

I've explained multiple times and provided multiple examples of coaches taking over programs built by others that had short term success (due to the overlap) but couldn't sustain. Many of the examples I provided were able to sustain for 2, maybe 3 seasons before all the magic was gone.

Well, Andy Thompson managed to destroy it all after only 1 season!

You're being disingenuous saying what you said all while ignoring not only this horrific season, but Andy Thompson's (and Bobby Fresques for that matter) track record or lack thereof.

These guys have accomplished NOTHING to warrant the free passes you are handing to them. If Thompson had a track record of success elsewhere as a head coach, then I'd understand. But he doesn't.

All he's managed to do thus far is completely obliterate the progress this program made the over past 5 years in only his 2nd season on the job.

Do you really think a great recruiting class is lining up after this disaster season? And even if one does -- what would he and Fresques be able to do with it?

IDK whether you remember this or not, but Thompson still has his fingerprints all over this defense and the players recruited to run it. And that side of the ball is by far the worst part of this team.

But let's forget about that for a minute. All anybody has to see and understand is this.

  • Thompson's 2nd season resulted in more losses (9) than the program suffered from 2019 through 2022 (8)
  • Thompson's BSC record after two seasons is 5-11; his predecessor went 23-1 in 3 seasons
  • Thompson's overall record after two seasons is 11-14; his predecessor went 30-8 in 3 seasons
And I won't even get into the steep decline in offensive and defensive production comparatively.

You really need to stop this nonsense, SD. I like you brother, but you're beginning to embarrass yourself.

Wake the hell up and actually pay attention to what you're seeing and what's already happened!
 
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HornetFootballFan said:
I love Conklin… but I’d rather have a winning program with new coaching staff. Doubt Conklin would be happy if he had another season at .500 or less…
Click to expand...

SD and anyone that agrees with him are delusional if they really believe this staff -- that just went 3-9 with losses to perennial cellar dwelling programs -- is going to magically rebound next season.

If they couldn't manage better than 3-9 and 1-7 this season, how or why is next season suddenly going to be different?

Is Ohio State, Georgia or Oregon gifting their 2025 recruiting class to Thompson?

Even if they did -- we now know that neither Thompson nor Fresques could properly orchestrate that talent.

They were left with a pretty full closet (in terms of FCS talent) and just finished in a last place tie with Northern Colorado.

Let's be real. While Troy Taylor was by no means a perfect head coach, the program's record and success was largely due to his offensive system. The defense was the weak link for the entire 4 years Taylor was here.

While they made strides from years past (Sears era and earlier) and even looked dominant at times, they were wildly inconsistent and often the main culprit in the losses.

To back that up, in the 8 losses during Taylor's tenure, the Hornets surrendured 19, 34, 36, 42, 34, 42, 24, 66. That's an average of 37.125 per game. To be fair, there are probably a few points mixed in there that were given up by the offense. But nowhere near enough to bring that average down much.

Who is winning games giving up that many points? Hell, 3 of those 8 games were playoff games in which the opponent scored 42, 24, and 66. The lone conference loss in 3 seasons saw the Hornets surrendering 36 to Weber State at home.

^^ The above was Andy Thompson's responsibility. And now he's the head coach and both sides of the ball have gone to hell.

Lastly, in the 8 losses during Taylor's tenure, the offense scored 7, 20, 17, 28, 16, 30, 19, 63. That's an average of 25 points per game. Not otherworldly, but not bad either. Certainly enough to win consistently with a capable defense.

Taylor's worst decision coaching was having Thompson as his DC. And Orr's worst decision was promoting Thompson to HC.

And here we are.
 
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BuckeyeHornetFan said:
SD and anyone that agrees with him are delusional if they really believe this staff -- that just went 3-9 with losses to perennial cellar dwelling programs -- is going to magically rebound next season.

If they couldn't manage better than 3-9 and 1-7 this season, how or why is next season suddenly going to be different?

Is Ohio State, Georgia or Oregon gifting their 2025 recruiting class to Thompson?

Even if they did -- we now know that neither Thompson nor Fresques could properly orchestrate that talent.

They were left with a pretty full closet (in terms of FCS talent) and just finished in a last place tie with Northern Colorado.

Let's be real. While Troy Taylor was by no means a perfect head coach, the program's record and success was largely due to his offensive system. The defense was the weak link for the entire 4 years Taylor was here.

While they made strides from years past (Sears era and earlier) and even looked dominant at times, they were wildly inconsistent and often the main culprit in the losses.

To back that up, in the 8 losses during Taylor's tenure, the Hornets surrendured 19, 34, 36, 42, 34, 42, 24, 66. That's an average of 37.125 per game. To be fair, there are probably a few points mixed in there that were given up by the offense. But nowhere near enough to bring that average down much.

Who is winning games giving up that many points? Hell, 3 of those 8 games were playoff games in which the opponent scored 42, 24, and 66. The lone conference loss in 3 seasons saw the Hornets surrendering 36 to Weber State at home.

^^ The above was Andy Thompson's responsibility. And now he's the head coach and both sides of the ball have gone to hell.

Lastly, in the 8 losses during Taylor's tenure, the offense scored 7, 20, 17, 28, 16, 30, 19, 63. That's an average of 25 points per game. Not otherworldly, but not bad either. Certainly enough to win consistently with a capable defense.

Taylor's worst decision coaching was having Thompson as his DC. And Orr's worst decision was promoting Thompson to HC.

And here we are.
Click to expand...
At the time when orr Promoted AT to HC. It seemed like a good decision,

I had assumed that Bobby F was active and learning like an apprentice sponge under TT,
He learned NOTHING which shows incompetence in itself.

Assumed the staff could keep momentum that was built.

I had no idea they would do the opposite of what they had been on staff to witness and get hands on training with,

Even the culture of loving the team was dismantled.

Winning Stanford was great! Losing to F UCD now 2X consecutively as well a disaster. Last season getting a playoff win made us all feel better

As well last season saying we only lost in playoffs because of injuries in secondary.

Then they didn’t recruit enough talented players to to build depth.

Strength & Conditioning coach appears to be a failure as well.

Past 2 seasons all we hear about is injured players…

Tired of excuses!

Montana Schools & Idaho don’t seem to stumble as badly as our staff.
 
Green Cookie Monster said:
Fulcher, Lynch, Bailey, Broussard

The defense went backwards and AT is supposed to be defensive minded. I saw many out of position plays where defense was completely sleeping.
Fresques needs to be on the sideline, coaching from his throne in the box doesnt help moral.
Click to expand...
I suggested early in season that Bobby leave the coaches box and get on the sideline so he can get better feel of the game.

Then he “blocked me” in a tantrum. Now last game of the season he goes to the sidelines to get more in synch with the game flow.

Too little too late. He is always too slow to adjust.
 
BHF & HFF, we've gone round and round on this topic in multiple threads so I'll just ask if you are willing to give Sears credit for Taylor winning immediately here. If not then your argument with Thompson is irrelevant. While comparing the win-loss records is notable, again it's just viewing the situation in a vacuum. This program was never going to maintain a near flawless BSC run, and expecting that with a coaching change and roster turnover is unrealistic. The fact that Taylor and his staff were able to navigate those issues over the years (as well as dealing with the China virus) speaks to how special his tenure here was. IMO most of the Thomspon complaints boil down to some folks just not being able to get over the fact that Taylor bailed for a big payday.

I take issue with claims that Andy destroyed what we have here. No, the team and offensive output leader leader quit which had a major impact to this season. Remember, there wasn't a mass exodus of players into the portal when Taylor left after the '22 season which means the roster was bought into the program. That said, I don't buy the premise that we can't be successful again with this coaching staff. There is a lot of young talent that got some serious run this season. If you are going to be bad, be young...and we had a significant amount of young players on the field this season. We'll see how the recruiting and the portal shakes out this offseason and if there is a mass exodus then there should be heightened concern about '25.

And stop conflating the points I've been stating about this season with it being acceptable for losing. Never ever have I said that the losses are acceptable and I've always stated that the coaches are accountable for this awful season. Would a 5-7 or 6-6 record stop any of the bitching and moaning from the detractors? Doubtful. There would still be plenty of fans viewing this season through a '22 lens and calling for heads.

Funny, I recall seeing folks claiming our program was gone because we lost a bunch of good players from the Taylor era and now folks are claiming the cabinet was full for Thompson and his staff. The reality is we lost some good players and had some good players ready to step up. This will likely remain the case heading into '25, depending on portal impacts.

Regarding Thompson's defenses, your points are valid but it's always been a bend but don't break approach. This idea that Taylor won in spite of Andy is despicable and is even more absurd when you factor in that it was Troy that brought him here. I mean, if we are going down that absurd line of thinking should we put this program collapse on Troy since he's the reason Andy is even here? Of course not. Crap happens and now it's on Andy to rectify the situation.

Traditionally, the BSC is a conference with a lot of high powered offenses and rarely does an outstanding defense exist in the BSC. I'm sure I could dig through the box scores from the last 5 years and find multiple close games in which the defense came through with timely stops to preserve a win or keep the game close. This year we looked much improved up front until we lost some key players to injury, the secondary has always been a mess as most FCS secondaries are. Andy is responsible for the defense and there is certainly plenty of room for improvement, but I don't recall ever having a Hornet defense being a dominant force (maybe '19 is in that discussion) that served as the backbone of the team.

For much of the ire from fellow Hornet fans I draw from sticking with Coach Thompson, I'll remain staunchly on the Andy train for at least one more year. With Coach Fresques, what we see is what we get and I don't expect him to turn a corner and figure it out at this point. I hope I'm wrong but it is what it is. However if keeping Bobby means Conklin stays, then I am good with that.
 
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