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Defense

There are so many problems with this defense, I don't even know where to start. Today was a complete embarrassment. These defensive players better be carrying the offense's equipment every day to thank them for saving their ass every week.

One thing that irritates the hell out of me is how we never seem to have our best 11 players on the field at any time. We are so hell bent on rotating players all the time, that we wind up with guys who aren't in the flow of the game. McDonald and Tonani had poor games, but the other safeties were absolutely shocking. And truth is, the two biggest plays from the defense came from Tonani (int) and McDonald (hit that KO'd Mangum).

Those guys should have seen 80% or more of the defensive plays, but were constantly being pulled off the field for one reason or another. It's nice to move guys in and out, but if it constantly results in a deficiency, you gotta roll the dice with what you've got.
 
BTW... The final tally today was 614 yards given up. They scored on their first two possessions and their last three. It's 6 games into the season, and the D looks to be getting worse. Yikes!

If our offense has any off days, we are ripe to be beaten. Hopefully, playing Southern Utah's meager offense lets up build some momentum. Unfortunately, we got a good game in against a weak UC Davis team but it just seemed to be a rogue performance out of many bad ones.
 
We blitzed and got burned, we rushed three and got burned.

ISU is a high quality offense and probably a top 4 team in the conference, maybe top two.

We have undersized or undeveloped and certainly inexperienced players on d line. Hamlin, McCarthy, and Havili are solid linebackers but lack speed. We are equally inexperienced at corner.

We WILL get better.

Relax and enjoy the ride. :nod:
 
I've noticed the lack of side to side speed in the Lb too. Not sure how that is going to improve over the rest of the season. Hard to find speed on tired legs.
Also, how are the corners and safeties going to improve? They are getting worse every game. Not sure just how much they can improve during the practices.
 
kalm said:
We blitzed and got burned, we rushed three and got burned.

ISU is a high quality offense and probably a top 4 team in the conference, maybe top two.

We have undersized or undeveloped and certainly inexperienced players on d line. Hamlin, McCarthy, and Havili are solid linebackers but lack speed. We are equally inexperienced at corner.

We WILL get better.

Relax and enjoy the ride. :nod:
Click to expand...

+1

We didn't get pressure on a good quarterback who has good receivers. Their tight end killed us because we get miserable drops from our linebackers and the seams in the middle of the field are always open on play action/zone read fakes. ISU is a very sound offense and I think is in the upper end of the BSC this year. If SUU scores more than 20 on us I will get seriously concerned.
 
Nobody plays any damn defense in this league, apparently, except UND and Montana. The joke on those two is that they don't play any offense.

The offense is so good the defense only needs to be competent to be a national championship contender. With a good defense, we probably are favored to win it.
 
This was just plain difficult to watch today, and trust me, I love watching these quality guys. Virtually any team we have left on the schedule can beat us if our offense has an off night. Today's game could have turned on just a couple of different plays (the Bengals dropped pick 6 for instance). I have complete confidence that we make the playoffs but how far we go is certainly suspect. I hope I am wrong but I have not seen improvement. Please tell me why I am wrong and how things are going to turn around on the defensive side of the ball.
 
I don't remember us ever "platooning" the entire defensive line like we have been doing before. Also subbing out guys at other positions every other play...ok, maybe the last part is an exxageration, I don't know.
 
After watching the game again, I agree with Kalm. That was a heck of an offense we went up against. In a lot of ways I see some of the BSC teams trying to replicate what EWU has been able to do offensively with the no huddle, balanced high speed attack. I thought ISU executed their offensive game plan very well. They did a good job of doing what we do, creating a situation where you need to be in a shootout to have a chance to win.

That being said, of their 14 offensive possessions, we forced them to punt 5 times, intercepted the ball once, and forced a field goal once. Maybe we wouldn't have had the same success if they didn't lose Manqum. But at the same time, I think if VA is not injured, they force those two punts in the third. Heck, they probably would not have stopped us from scoring either play.

My opinion is that our defense just needs to do what's necessary to let our offense win the game. They did that this game against a dang good Offense! Now, the question is, will they be able to do enough without VA in the game to put us in a position to win. Who knows. But I don't think the next four offenses we face our nearly as good. And I honestly think that West is a very decent QB from what I've seen. I think we win the next four, even without VA. These teams will likely have their best offensive performances against us, and at least a couple of them will be too close for comfort, and likely a bit frustrating. UM could be a different story without VA.
 
He'll have 4 games to play before Montana, (almost) any QB will do great in our offense assuming he can put the ball on wide open wide receivers numbers...or even NEAR them as their hands appear to be football magnets.
 
After reading lots of posts on here I agree the lack of defensive performance is frustrating. I think there are a lot of factors that have already been pointed out. Youth at Dline, a rotating group across the whole defense (which will only make us better across the board, leaving our players fresh later in the year in the playoffs) a LB group that is having to play the run a little more respecting the PA pass because of the youth on the Dline and having to play with Dline in their laps. The thing that keeps running through my mind, and I haven't rewatched the game since attending on Saturday or looked at the stat line, is how long it seemed like our defensive group was on the field. It seemed like we got a few stops late in the first and in the second but then our offense sputtered and gave the ball back. Without Forte, it didn't seem like we got a steady rushing game going, and it left us throwing the football. We usually score fast, but our possessions seemed to go by really fast. There was one drive late in the game, I think beginning of the fourth quarter, that we had a good drive that kept our O on the field for a bit and probably swung the stats back to closer to even, but it is hard for a defense to have to respond so many times. Hell, we got a stop, a blocked punt and a Zylstra score and then had to go right back on to defense. Sorry for the long drawn out rambling post. Just one poor man's opinion.
 
EagerEagle said:
After reading lots of posts on here I agree the lack of defensive performance is frustrating. I think there are a lot of factors that have already been pointed out. Youth at Dline, a rotating group across the whole defense (which will only make us better across the board, leaving our players fresh later in the year in the playoffs) a LB group that is having to play the run a little more respecting the PA pass because of the youth on the Dline and having to play with Dline in their laps. The thing that keeps running through my mind, and I haven't rewatched the game since attending on Saturday or looked at the stat line, is how long it seemed like our defensive group was on the field. It seemed like we got a few stops late in the first and in the second but then our offense sputtered and gave the ball back. Without Forte, it didn't seem like we got a steady rushing game going, and it left us throwing the football. We usually score fast, but our possessions seemed to go by really fast. There was one drive late in the game, I think beginning of the fourth quarter, that we had a good drive that kept our O on the field for a bit and probably swung the stats back to closer to even, but it is hard for a defense to have to respond so many times. Hell, we got a stop, a blocked punt and a Zylstra score and then had to go right back on to defense. Sorry for the long drawn out rambling post. Just one poor man's opinion.
Click to expand...

Interesting, Eastern held a 10 minute possession advantage. Sometimes the offense scores fast, but the defense gives up scores just as fast or faster. I've heard that Oregon analogy before, but it isn't accurate with us. The offense keeps possession and piles up yards. Really, they are making life pretty easy for the D, but it isn't resulting in the defense making stops.

Southern Utah is pretty bad on offense. If there was ever a game to turn a corner, it's this one. If the defense gets hammered again this week, that'll be really scary. I have a feeling we'll see much better results on Saturday; however, the big question is whether D-ing up a team like SUU is a sign of improvement, or if the D will regress again shortly thereafter.

The Eagle D looked solid against a completely one dimensional and mostly inept UC Davis offense.
 
Ammen Olsen threw for over 400 yards and 3 touchdowns against Poly. He played about the same versus Weber. SUU is getting better on O.
 
True 'nuff. I can only view stats, because I haven't seen them play at all. They've been held under 20 points in 4 of their 6 games. I didn't think South Dakota State was great defensively last year, but they held them to a whopping 6 and had a pick 6 against them.

It does appear that they are improving, but those bigger numbers came against teams who aren't very good. The don't offer much running threat at all. This is a game that the D should shine in. It would be terribly disappointing to get rolled up and embarrassed by Southern Utah. The D had them on lockdown last year.
 
LDopaPDX said:
True 'nuff. I can only view stats, because I haven't seen them play at all. They've been held under 20 points in 4 of their 6 games. I didn't think South Dakota State was great defensively last year, but they held them to a whopping 6 and had a pick 6 against them.

It does appear that they are improving, but those bigger numbers came against teams who aren't very good. The don't offer much running threat at all. This is a game that the D should shine in. It would be terribly disappointing to get rolled up and embarrassed by Southern Utah. The D had them on lockdown last year.
Click to expand...

Looks like Ammon Olsen is a transfer from BYU and is mobile and can throw it. A little older too, so more mature? Seemed pretty composed in the little I have watched. Here's his Bio off the SUU site:

Returns to SUU this spring after transferring from BYU. Originally signed with the Thunderbirds out of high school in 2009, was SUU's backup that fall before serving an LDS church mission in Mexico. Transferred to BYU following his mission, where he spent the 2012 season as a redshirt and the 2013 as the No. 2 quarterback for the Cougars.

Personal: Earned Utah’s 5A Most Valuable Player honors last season after captaining Coach Les Hamilton’s Alta High Hawks to their second straight state championship and third consecutive region title. Was also named Utah’s Gatorade Player of the Year in 2008 when he completed 193-of-306 passes (63.1 percent) for 3,209 yards and 36 touchdowns and ran for 860 yards and another 11 scores. Led his team to four second-half comeback wins last year. Was also a three-year letterman on the AHS basketball team and earned region MVP honors as a senior. Parents are Stephanie and Bryan Olsen. Is undecided upon a major course of study.
Click to expand...

SUU just doesn't look that good, but Olsen has a few games under his belt now and was a top talent out of HS. Play a 3-4 and bring pressure 60+ % of the time with 1 or 2 LB's and play press, man coverage (tough to tell with the camera view). Eag's should eat their lunch all day. So little offense, it's painful to watch. Agree they will be pinning their ears back early to try and get to JW. Expect Coach B to have a TE in the set to help early, but he's crazy so anything is possible :lol: Our RB's catch the ball well and WR's make people miss so the short passing game extends the field sideline to sideline. If JW comes out hot, deep ball should be there too.
 
luckyintheorder said:
LDopaPDX said:
True 'nuff. I can only view stats, because I haven't seen them play at all. They've been held under 20 points in 4 of their 6 games. I didn't think South Dakota State was great defensively last year, but they held them to a whopping 6 and had a pick 6 against them.

It does appear that they are improving, but those bigger numbers came against teams who aren't very good. The don't offer much running threat at all. This is a game that the D should shine in. It would be terribly disappointing to get rolled up and embarrassed by Southern Utah. The D had them on lockdown last year.
Click to expand...

Looks like Ammon Olsen is a transfer from BYU and is mobile and can throw it. A little older too, so more mature? Seemed pretty composed in the little I have watched. Here's his Bio off the SUU site:

Returns to SUU this spring after transferring from BYU. Originally signed with the Thunderbirds out of high school in 2009, was SUU's backup that fall before serving an LDS church mission in Mexico. Transferred to BYU following his mission, where he spent the 2012 season as a redshirt and the 2013 as the No. 2 quarterback for the Cougars.

Personal: Earned Utah’s 5A Most Valuable Player honors last season after captaining Coach Les Hamilton’s Alta High Hawks to their second straight state championship and third consecutive region title. Was also named Utah’s Gatorade Player of the Year in 2008 when he completed 193-of-306 passes (63.1 percent) for 3,209 yards and 36 touchdowns and ran for 860 yards and another 11 scores. Led his team to four second-half comeback wins last year. Was also a three-year letterman on the AHS basketball team and earned region MVP honors as a senior. Parents are Stephanie and Bryan Olsen. Is undecided upon a major course of study.
Click to expand...

SUU just doesn't look that good, but Olsen has a few games under his belt now and was a top talent out of HS. Play a 3-4 and bring pressure 60+ % of the time with 1 or 2 LB's and play press, man coverage (tough to tell with the camera view). Eag's should eat their lunch all day. So little offense, it's painful to watch. Agree they will be pinning their ears back early to try and get to JW. Expect Coach B to have a TE in the set to help early, but he's crazy so anything is possible :lol: Our RB's catch the ball well and WR's make people miss so the short passing game extends the field sideline to sideline. If JW comes out hot, deep ball should be there too.
Click to expand...

Former BYU Head Coach, Gary Crowton, is also the new OC.
 
EWURanger said:
I don't remember us ever "platooning" the entire defensive line like we have been doing before. Also subbing out guys at other positions every other play...ok, maybe the last part is an exxageration, I don't know.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Have mentioned the weird substitution patterns in games. Last year we put our smallish DE's in on the goal line against Towson in the fourth quarter and their RB ran through the tackles as an instance. (darn good back)

There is a distinct lack of communication with the defense and the numerous changes at all positions could be a contributing factor as well as youth. However, a lot of these young players from last year and now have several games under their belts, so what's the deal?

See the BSC as a stronger league overall now than it was in the 2000's, where a little talent on D went a long way. Shouldn't we be looking for someone who can keep up with the pace of change as a priority if Natty's are in style and the Gateway is to be built? I can live with the Eastern where we did the sine wave every 3-5 years when a senior led team would make a splash; not hearing that from Coach Baldwin. Enjoying the ride and would love to see the players, coaches and institution earn another Natty before it is all said and done.

If, "players play and coaches coach"; where is the breakdown?

We roll SUU. Go Eags!
 
Agreed, really liked what I saw from the D. Even on some of the plays where they converted some 3rd downs, the QB was running for his life, and a shoestring away from being tackled. Their team made some clutch plays, but our D was on the verge of stopping most of them. They looked aggressive and stout. If they can continue to play, or even improve upon this, I think we will be unstoppable if we can get healthy in our offensive positions.

The offense managed the game well, but it is pretty incredible the difference without VA, especially with the QB mobility. West played well, and I'm glad he's our backup. But I'm excited for VA, and Forte's return.
 
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